The Hate U Give author Angie Thomas wants her new fantasy book to teach kids about racism
She talks to Tom Power about her new YA novel and how TLC’s Lisa 'Left Eye' Lopes saved her life
Angie Thomas's bestselling debut novel, The Hate U Give, tackled issues around race and police brutality, proving to the publishing world that there was a big audience for diverse stories among kids.
Since then, Thomas has gone on to write a string of successful YA novels, but now she's back with her first fantasy book, Nic Blake and the Remarkables: The Manifestor Prophecy.
"One reason I wrote this fantasy book is because of a lot of conversations that were happening in 2020 after the death of George Floyd and Breonna Taylor," Thomas said in an interview with Q's Tom Power.
"There were conversations about what would the world look like if we totally rethought the way policing happens, especially in America? What would the world look like if there weren't prisons? What if we focused on rehabilitation?… And then there were people who would push back and say, 'Oh, that's a fantasy, that's a fantasy.' Even the idea of Black people living in a world where they're not racially profiled … there were people who wanted to say that type of world is the fantasy — but I decided to make it my fantasy world."
In the fantasy world of Nic Blake and the Remarkables, there are no prisons and policing is a social service that goes beyond the scope of law enforcement.
"Even though it's a fantasy book, it deals with a lot of real-world issues," said Thomas. "There's a discussion about Emmett Till, there's a discussion about lynching, there's a discussion about racial profiling and police brutality. Because, like it or not, these are things that even 12-year-old Black kids have had to have discussions about. So I would be doing them a disservice if I didn't include them in the book."
Especially here in the States, there are a lot of conversations about banning books and what kids should and shouldn't know.- Angie Thomas
Thomas learned about the lynching of Emmett Till — a Black teenager who was killed for whistling at a white woman in Mississippi in 1955 — when she was just about six years old.
"I learned about these things early on," said the author. "And I think that's what bothers me so much about right now, especially here in the States, there are a lot of conversations about banning books and what kids should and shouldn't know. And there are people who don't want kids to know history, but if kids don't know history, how do they know how not to repeat it?
"Me learning those things, it didn't tarnish me, it didn't turn me against anyone. It made me aware of the things that have happened in the past, but it also helped me to learn that despite these things happening, my worth is not factored into the belief system, the racism of someone else."
For Thomas, it's important to share these stories with young people through her work as an author — and she thinks fantasy is one of the best vehicles to achieve that.
"I still want to spark conversations," she said. "I'm not going into a whole lot of detail in it, but there's enough that if a kid reads this book, if they don't know who it is, they're going to know something now, and then maybe, just maybe, they'll want to find out more."
How TLC's Lisa 'Left Eye' Lopes saved her life
There are two rappers who've been particularly meaningful to Thomas in terms of her storytelling: Tupac (whose work inspired the titles of two of Thomas's books) and Lisa "Left Eye" Lopes of the girl group TLC.
"I have a whole story — a personal story — with how she helped save my life," Thomas told Power.
My mom goes on AskJeeves.com … and to this day, I don't know how she did it, but she asked Jeeves for Left Eye's phone number.- Angie Thomas
When the author was about 13 or 14 years old, she was bullied relentlessly in school, which affected her mental health. Her mom decided to homeschool her, but Thomas was still struggling.
"One day, I had a serious low, to the point that I wanted to permanently harm myself," she said. "I locked myself up in the bathroom with every intention to hurt myself, but I also had my little CD Walkman with my headphones, and Waterfalls by TLC started playing and Left Eye's rap came on.
"And at the end of the rap, she says, 'Dreams are hopeless aspirations and hopes are coming true. Believe in yourself, the rest is up to me and you.' And I remember hearing that and going, 'Oh, wow, I have all these hopes, all these dreams, all these aspirations, and I can't see them happen if I do something to myself.'"
Thomas left the bathroom and told her mom what she had intended to do, and how the TLC song affected her.
"My mom goes, 'Well, if the song affected you like that, I can only imagine what talking to her or something would do,'" said Thomas.
"Let me just add some context: this is like 2001, 2002. My mom goes on AskJeeves.com, which was like the original Google, and to this day, I don't know how she did it, but she asked Jeeves for Left Eye's phone number — and she got the phone number to her studio, which was in her house. So basically, she got her home phone number. And so she calls and she talks to Lisa's assistant, and she tells her about me."
Thomas was watching TV in another room when her mom came in with the phone, saying someone wanted to talk to her.
"I get on the phone and she goes, 'Hey, it's Left Eye,'" said Thomas. "I flipped out. I ran around the house screaming. Finally I got myself together and I got on the phone and I talked to Lisa 'Left Eye' Lopes and she got to know me a little bit. Then she asked about what was going on, what had happened with me in school and stuff, and I told her about everything. And she just said, 'Now, I don't know you, but I have a feeling you're going to do something big one day and you got to stick around to do it.'"
The full interview with Angie Thomas is available on our podcast, Q with Tom Power. Listen and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
Interview with Angie Thomas produced by Ben Edwards.
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