Destroy or preserve? Why there's disagreement over how we view our historical figures

John A. Macdonald. Egerton Ryerson. Queen Victoria.

For some, they're the great heroes and nation builders of Canada. For others, they're imperialists, racists and criminals whose statues should be pulled from their pedestals and purged from public spaces. Though statues have been removed before, more than 20 statues and memorials across Canada were toppled and degraded by activists or removed by officials since 2020. Inside the Statue Wars delves into the battle over our public memorials. 

Lasana Harris is a social neuroscientist at University College London. He specializes in anthropomorphism, attributing human characteristics to animals or to inanimate objects, like statues of historic figures. 

In the interview below, which has been edited for length and clarity, he reflects on the statue wars in Canada and around the world. 

What do you think statues symbolize? Are protesters really directing their anger toward the historic figures, like Queen Victoria or John A. Macdonald?

That's what's interesting about the statue topplings. They're not necessarily about the individuals [depicted by the statue] — they're more about the things that those individuals represent.… So being able to topple and decapitate a statue is really a powerful symbol of attempting to change societies.… 

It's impossible to directly attack the people that are represented in those statues because they're long gone.… But taking down the statue is removing [them] from a place of importance.

You've mentioned cognitive dissonance plays a role here. Could you explain?

A racialized or minoritized person in these societies struggles with this feeling of dissonance, because on the one hand, there's a sense of belonging to where they're born and raised and where they've had all of their experiences, where their family now lives. But within that society, they're devalued, and … these symbols, these statues, are constant reminders that they are not valued as equal members of society — so they don't belong.… [Toppling statues] removes the symbols that remind you that you are devalued within the society.

Does it have big societal impact? Not immediately. But I think it does matter for the people who feel othered by these symbols because now it makes them feel more of a part of that society, and it may also motivate them to engage in other activities that will also lead to systemic change.

What is going on in the minds of people who topple statues in a group?

If you think about a big sporting tournament, people support a particular team because of some affiliation. But the success of the team allows the people to … bask in what we call that reflected glory. Just as a supporter, I now feel the joy that the players are feeling for their accomplishment. It becomes my own accomplishment. 

I think that's what you're seeing [when statues are toppled]:, that symbolic act of defiance is now celebrated in that wider community as something that [everyone] can all bask in. 

The parts of the brain that we associate with rational thinking, emotion regulation … tend to get switched off or dampened when we're engaging in [a group activity with a shared goal] because, fundamentally, we're social creatures, and it takes a lot of self-control or willpower to go against the grain. So, to relinquish that self-control and be part of the group is a joyous experience for people because it's less effortful — it's less cognitively demanding or taxing.

Any kind of social activity where [we are] connecting to other people gives us large boosts in neurochemicals, like dopamine, that make us feel good and enhances feelings of connection. 

Why do some people value statues and fight to keep them up?

I think people erect statues in public spaces for two or three reasons.… [One] is a sense of pride. There was a sense of pride in establishing Canada as an independent country in this frontier land, and so [they believe] we should celebrate the actors who help[ed] make that possible.

So even if they understand why others may oppose the statues, for them, the idea of removing it is [akin to] removing a bit of themselves because it's degrading this prideful representation that boosts their sense of self and self-esteem.

[Seeing a statue toppled leads to] people feeling as if change is afoot. And change is uncomfortable. 

And so seeing a street that you knew as a particular name for all of your life suddenly have a different name, while [at the same time] the composition of the people on television is changing and statues are being torn down, while you're hearing about horrific things that were swept under the rug, there's a lot of information now that is counter to your idea of the group and its importance and its value. I think that's what's uncomfortable for people. 

What do you make of the argument that we need to keep painful symbols of the past, like statues, because they serve as opportunities to teach the lessons of history, good and bad?

I think the argument that we can learn from the history associated with these statues is valid. I don't think the statue has to be in a public space to do that. We've built institutions for these purposes — museums — and I think that's where we can house these symbols. And in fact, a lot of the statues that have been pulled down have now been adopted by museums for exactly this purpose.

They become teaching moments, [used to] talk to future generations … about the historical atrocities and the approach that people in modern societies have taken to address those atrocities. And you can show that arc, and that's a real learning experience. So, I don't think statues need to all be destroyed, but I think they're in the wrong places.  

I just don't think they should be in the public space because it's supposed to be a space for everyone. And if some people are feeling excluded by its presence, that should be enough to remove it. 

Have there been societal benefits from the wave of statue topplings?

I think the benefit is just having the conversation in the first place. People have not had these conversations previously, but the statue topplings are so emotive that they capture our attention, they suck us in, and they now cause us to have these conversations within our own groups, with people who we might not have had that conversation with before, with complete strangers that we meet as we go through our lives.

I think these things like the statue topplings hint at a broader problem in society that needs to be addressed, and those things can only be addressed with structural change. So, it's a case of us deciding what kind of society do we want to live in, and I think that's what's happening now.