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AIH JUL 10

NIL KÖKSAL: Hello, I'm Nil Köksal.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Good evening. I'm Chris Howden. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme].

CHRIS HOWDEN: Tonight...

NIL KÖKSAL: Minding the gap, the head of UNAIDS says it is painful and cruel to watch life-saving progress erode because of Donald Trump's abrupt cuts to funding. She tells us there are solutions but they'll only work if countries like Canada step in to fill the void.

CHRIS HOWDEN: At crossing purposes, amid the immigration crackdown in the U.S., one Quebec border crossing sees a surge in asylum applications. A woman who works with new arrivals from Haiti tells us about the fears of the families showing up at her door.

NIL KÖKSAL: Lensing a hand, researchers in California develop a new underwater microscope, and our guest says it's already bringing fragile coral ecosystems into focus in their natural habitat instead of a lab.

CHRIS HOWDEN: A real corker. After a Newfoundland couple stuck a message in a bottle, they didn't think about it much until it ended up in the hands of another couple all the way across the Atlantic Ocean 13 years later.

NIL KÖKSAL: Hidden in airplane sight, Heathrow Airport sets out to capture the magic of the airport by commissioning a subtle soundtrack that incorporates the sounds of the airport to be played on repeat at the airport.

CHRIS HOWDEN: And monkey see, monkey do what now? Chimpanzees in Zambia appear to be sticking grass in their ears as a kind of fashion trend, which they may have learned from humans and also in their rumps, which it appears they taught themselves. As It Happens, the Thursday edition, radio that salutes them for bladesing a trail.

[Music: Theme extro]

CHRIS HOWDEN: If the world does not act, decades of progress to prevent HIV infections will be unraveled. That was the dire message delivered by UNAIDS today in its 2025 global update. The organization predicts that without more funding, an additional 6 million people will be infected with HIV by 2029, 4 million more will die, and that's largely because in February, the U.S. Government abruptly halted funding for a program known as PEPFAR, which financed about 70 per cent of the global response to AIDS. Winnie Byanyima has been trying to fill in the gaps ever since. She is the Executive Director of UNAIDS. We reached her in Johannesburg, South Africa.

NIL KÖKSAL: Winnie Byanyima, before we talk about broadly what these cuts mean for people right around the world, I wonder for you personally, how are you dealing with this current reality?

WINNIE BYANYIMA: It's very painful and very... It's just so cruel, so cruel because it was not necessary to withdraw funding for life-saving services so suddenly. Before this cut, other donors had been cutting their aid gradually. Again, the countries were saying they had other priorities and they did, they did. But this is the most amazing story, success story of global health. It was delivering. It was moving towards ending the disease. That's not the time to turn away. So, we are disappointed, but we are even more resolute in supporting countries, developing countries to keep the fight on. They are all finding innovative ways of plugging the hole, but the hole is big. Let's not make mistakes about it. We do need all the countries of the world to maintain their support to fight and end this disease.

NIL KÖKSAL: It's a collaboration is what you're [WINNIE BYANYIMA: Absolutely] clearly underlining there. What we're hearing though, from the U.S. Administration, the Trump administration, is really the antithesis of that. And they are very much in a place clearly right now of America is for Americans, we don't need to help, you know, other countries deal with their issues. That's the messaging coming from that country. So, how do you try to change minds?

WINNIE BYANYIMA: It's not for me to comment on their own policies. However, not even the greatest country in the world, the richest country in the world can solve a problem like climate change on its own. Or even end a pandemic on their on. This virus doesn't know any borders. If it continues to fester in some countries, people will take it and it will be back where... They think they have stopped it. So, it just is not, it doesn't make sense to look at global problems like they are, like you can solve them individually.

NIL KÖKSAL: When news of these cuts first broke back in February, we reached a Canadian nurse who was working for the charity, Farmers Helping Farmers, it's based in Prince Edward Island, and she was working in Kenya. Here's a little bit of what she told us about how people there in Maru County were reacting.

SOUNDCLIP

CANADIAN NURSE: They were just told from one day to the next, different people I spoke to at different dispensaries and community hospitals where we were, they're basically fighting tears because they have so many people, that's their full-time job is managing these people that are positive with HIV and AIDS. And just right now, they don't know what the future holds.

NIL KÖKSAL: How does that, Winnie, align with the kinds of stories you're hearing from people around the world?

WINNIE BYANYIMA: It's true, the sudden cuts through everyone in panic. We had clinics that were shut immediately. Civil society, NGOs, communities who were part of service delivery and had contracts with PEPFAR were stopped immediately. And that meant that people woke up and didn't know where to go to get a refill. Or some went and lined up and were told, "No, today there's nothing, you have to come back." That panic then gave way slowly to some planning by some governments, telling people to calm down and starting to look for ways to serve those who were unserved. And we are trying to show them how they can do it without losing the gains they had made earlier through the generous support of the international community.

NIL KÖKSAL: Those kinds of threads of hope or positive signs or responses as best countries and people can in these difficult and dire times will be reassuring for a lot of people listening. It's, you cover that in your report as well, making sure that you're clear in this conversation too, that there are solutions, there are ways to do this. Of course, the funding is [WINNIE BYANYIMA: Yes] still very much needed. And how do you reassure though, you know, people on that front lines, people who are are losing their services or it's more difficult to access them now, how do you reassure them in these times?

WINNIE BYANYIMA: This is the hardest part because one part of it is financial and one way to reassure them is to work closely with the communities themselves and with the governments to find creative ways to deliver the same services more cost-effectively and, of course, to challenge them to reallocate resources. But here's the challenge, the biggest challenge. The biggest challenge is on rights. We are seeing a pushback on the rights, on the laws that are needed to enable people to access life-saving services. How do you reassure a gay man in Uganda that they are going to be served, they will get the prevention they need when a new law has just been passed that criminalizes them further, that puts a burden on health workers to identify them and report to the police? How do you reassure person like that? So, there are challenges. I have to be very honest with you, we have to work on the rights front. But I must say for me, I'm inspired when I'm here, like now in South Africa, on the front lines, I feel fulfilled standing side by side with those whose lives, who are fighting for their lives. It gives me, yeah, a sense of being on the right side of history, on the right side of rights as opposed to the disappointment and the pain of seeing rich people taking away life-saving services from the poorest people.

NIL KÖKSAL: Winnie Byanyima, I'm so glad we could speak. Thank you for coming on our show.

WINNIE BYANYIMA: Thank you for your questions.

NIL KÖKSAL: Thank you.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Winnie Byanyima is the Executive Director of UNAIDS. We reached her in Johannesburg, South Africa.

[String music playing]

CHRIS HOWDEN: Most of the time, when you see a bottle on the beach, it's garbage. The only message it delivers is that someone was too lazy to put it in the recycling bin. But on Monday afternoon, Kate Gay and her husband John were taking a walk along the beach near their home in southwestern Ireland, and the bottle they found on that walk has taken them on a figurative journey across the Atlantic Ocean to Canada. We reached Kate Gay on Maharees off the Dingle Peninsula in Ireland.

NIL KÖKSAL: Kate, what were you doing when this bottle first caught your eye?

KATE GAY: We were walking along our local beach, which is about 200 metres from our house, so just taking the dog for a walk like we do every day.

NIL KÖKSAL: And what did you see?

KATE GAY: We saw a lot of seaweed washed up because we'd had some high winds at the weekend, so that's fairly normal, but yeah, just peeping out of the seaweed was a glass bottle. So, we picked the bottle up, went over and picked the bottle up and saw that it had got paper in it [NIL KÖKSAL: Oh], and didn't really register it in terms of... Seriously, it's a message in a bottle. This is about lunchtime, but I decided not to open it immediately because completely coincidentally, we had a project team meeting that evening. So, I thought "Wow! What a fun thing to do, for us to open it together and see what's there. There might be something, there might be words, there might not."

NIL KÖKSAL: And you recorded that reading. So, we're going to listen to a bit of it together and our listeners can hear it as well.

SOUNDCLIP

UNKNOWN VOICE: So September 14, 2012, Anita and Brad's day trip to Belle Island. Today, we enjoyed dinner, this bottle of wine, and each other on the edge of the island. If you find this, please call us. Anita and Brad. To Anita and Brad!

OTHER VOICES: To Anita and Brad!

NIL KÖKSAL: To Anita and Brad, oh, there's so much there just in those few lines.

KATE GAY: Well, we couldn't believe, one, that there was writing on it, but then just what it said in a few simple words. It was so beautiful, really. I'd made a mojito mocktail to start the meeting. So, we all happened to be drinking that. And we just, yes, you heard it. We just raised a glass. [Inaudible].

NIL KÖKSAL: You couldn't help but raise a glass. What a lovely thing. So, as we heard, it's written in 2012, sent from Belle Island off of Newfoundland and Labrador. Did you hesitate at all before trying to track these folks down?

KATE GAY: No, so the person who read out the note was Jan Spillans and she, as soon as she finished that, she just went away and got her phone and tried to call the number, but it didn't get through. And then, after the meeting, Martha, um, who heads up, um, Maharees Conservation Association went home and sort of late, quite late at night, decided to put a Facebook post up saying, "Does anybody know Anita and Brad, uh, over the other side of the Atlantic?" She couldn't believe it. By, within an hour, they had been traced [inaudible] message... [NIL KÖKSAL: Within an hour!] Yeah, Anita messaged Martha and they started a short conversation and the rest is history.

NIL KÖKSAL: We actually have Anita on the line as well now. Hello to you, Anita.

ANITA SQUIRES: Hi.

NIL KÖKSAL: I know you guys have been messaging. It's great to chat with you as well. What do you remember about that night as much as you can say on the radio, Anita?

ANITA SQUIRES: Well, it was like an afternoon, we both had the day off and we both do, Brad's always a police officer and I'm a nurse, so we have the day off, that day together. Sometimes, we have like special dates in the daytime just because of shift work and it was a nice day and yeah, there's a boat that goes over to Belle Island. It's less than 20-minute ferry ride. So, we went over for the day and it was nice and we decided we'd get a picnic and we just popped into the store there. And picked up a few snacks and a very strong, sturdy bottle of wine, I guess. And we went and yeah, we had a picnic on, as most of the island is, a dramatic edge of the cliff. And we thought, well, we just drank this bottle of wine and had a lovely day. Why don't we see if we can find a paper and poke a little note in? And so, we wrote this little note just to ourselves into the ocean, I guess. Brad, we put the cap on the bottle very securely, I'm very proud of us, and Brad threw it over the cliff, the big cliff that was there, and we definitely thought that it shattered and hit the rock. So, yeah, to hear that it didn't end there and it went on quite a journey was quite a surprise to us.

NIL KÖKSAL: Yeah, this was not a plan. Let's see what happens in a few years if we get a call, you know, one day. So then, when you do get that call...

ANITA SQUIRES: Yeah, so yeah, Brad was putting our little one to bed and both of our phones were dinging and Brad came out and we saw the message and we just couldn't believe it. We were laughing and we, I sent a message on Facebook to the conservation group and that's when I started talking to Martha and she said they were doing a toast and she wrote a quote in there, "Love conquers all even the Atlantic Ocean," and we just thought that was the cutest, and they said they were doing a cheers and we did a cheers to them and it's just, yeah, it's just a really sweet story, a sweet memory for us that you know didn't end 13 years ago. Here it is again.

NIL KÖKSAL: No, you, it was the start for you guys. You're married, you have kids now. Kate, I'll bring you back in. I mean, how wonderful to bring, to have this joy with your friends, but also to bring this joy back to Anita and Brad. What do you make of how all of this has connected you all?

KATE GAY: Uh, it's, it's miraculous, really. It just seems like the, you know, it's like the bottle was sort of captured a happy moment. It's come all the way across the Atlantic, and we've released a lot of happiness so into the world. Having tra--, you know, it's traveled 3,000 kilometres, and that connection has been made through the message in a bottle.

NIL KÖKSAL: Anita, do you think you and Brad are going to meet up with Kate and and her crew who who were raising a glass to both of you? Any plans afoot?

ANITA SQUIRES: Yes. But actually, when we were chatting, we realized that both of our 10-year anniversary, their conservation group and our wedding anniversary, is 10 years next year. So, we think wouldn't that be a sweet little trip? Maybe they'll come see us, maybe we'll come to see them, but to keep in touch and definitely do that.

NIL KÖKSAL: That sounds delightful. Anita, Kate, say hello to Brad as well. Thank you all for your time.

KATE GAY: Yes, thank you, thank you.

ANITA SQUIRES: Thank you so much.

CHRIS HOWDEN: We reached Anita Squires in Portugal Cove-St. Philip's, Newfoundland and Labrador. And Kate Gay is on Maharees in Ireland.

[Upright bass music playing]

CHRIS HOWDEN: Now, I have some slightly distressing news. Our closest relatives are getting weirder. Researchers have discovered a strange behaviour in captive chimpanzees at a sanctuary in Zambia. They are frequently seen running around with blades of grass or sticks shoved into their ears or in a variation that seems a little more avant garde shoved up their behinds. Jake Brooker coordinated the newly published study in the journal Behavior. We reached him in Durham, England.

NIL KÖKSAL: Jake, I'm sure you've seen chimpanzees do a lot of things. Where do these behaviors sit on that spectrum?

JAKE BROOKER: I would say these behaviors sit maybe as the top or the second most shocking things that I've seen probably in the chimpanzees that I work with. The first day that I was told that Juma was engaging in these behaviours, I was surprised but, you know, my scientific curiosity was peaked. So, we're very keen to find out what was going on.

NIL KÖKSAL: Yeah, I bet. I bet. What was the, what was the first most surprising or shocking thing? If these are the second?

JAKE BROOKER: Oh, yeah. About six years ago, I was conducting what we call post-conflict follows where we follow the victim of a conflict to see who engages with them as a form of conflict resolution. And I noticed a young male, so a young male victim, I was following him, and he engaged in post-conflict fellatio with another... Another adult male chimpanzee and that was, yeah, really surprising, and you can hear in the video footage that I recorded that I was just very confused. [Inaudible] chimpanzees ever.

NIL KÖKSAL: Well, yeah. One would be. I did not expect you to say any of the things that you just said, but thank you for sharing and doing that important work. In all seriousness, though: The blade of a grass, or the grass in the ear, did you notice that first? Were they doing that first.

JAKE BROOKER: We have been working with a few groups of the chimpanzees for a really long time, and we know that they engage in a lot of different, like, social cultural behaviors, and we noticed that there was this sort of arbitrary social custom that was going on with wearing grass stems in their ears, and that mimicked something that had been observed about 15 years ago by one of my colleagues in a whole different group, completely unrelated from the group that we were working with. So, we were really shocked that this had happened again, that it had been spontaneously innovated and spread socially in a whole new group. And then, we were even more shocked that they were doing their own spin on this by also inserting the grass and sticks in a different orifice.

NIL KÖKSAL: And when you're talking about in the ear, it's not actually it's not like tucking a flower behind your ear, they're sticking it in their ear canal.

JAKE BROOKER: Yeah, I don't know how deep it goes, but it's deep enough that you see when they're learning this behaviour that it's quite uncomfortable and they seem to be, like they shake their head and they rub their ear a little bit as if they're getting, you know, trying to get used to it. But it reminds me of, like, when people get earrings and they have to go for a bit of discomfort in order to start wearing earrings and engaging in that kind of cultural behaviour. And I feel like it's similar with the grass and air. They are willing to go through this discomfort for some kind of social benefit.

NIL KÖKSAL: And what about the other orifice, as you put it?

JAKE BROOKER: Yeah, that one is probably a little bit more uncomfortable and I also don't know what kind of benefit it brings, but there must be some reason for them why they want to copy these things.

NIL KÖKSAL: What, at this stage, why do you think they're doing it? What's your hunch?

JAKE BROOKER: Well, I think it could be a form of fostering group identity. They're doing that, maybe just someone just randomly discovered this behaviour. They might have potentially copied it from a human who was walking by the enclosure or one of the caregivers who was, you know, just going about their daily lives and they might have seen something that then they decided to copy [NIL KÖKSAL: The grass in the ear part, I'm thinking is what you're talking about]. I thoroughly hope so, yes. But I would assume that one could have been spread by maybe just copying someone and then, like with all cultures, things change over time and they get refined and new quirks and new traditions pop up. And so, who knows? Maybe that's what led to the, Juma, you know, discovering, yeah, a new tradition.

NIL KÖKSAL: In this, so this is obviously happening with the chimpanzees at this sanctuary. Do you think it's happening outside of it as well in the wild?

JAKE BROOKER: So, behaviours like this have not been documented in wild chimpanzees, as far as I'm aware, but I think often the reason why symbolic, like, non-functional cultural behaviour has not been documented is because people often just aren't really looking for it, or possibly not knowing how to look for it or what sort of behaviours could be these sort of arbitrary things that could be important to them and just don't have obvious benefits to our human eyes. And this reminds me, when we observed these behaviours, it reminded me of the orcas from, I think, the '80s who were wearing dead salmon on their heads as some kind of strange social trend, and that, like, all sorts of trends. [NIL KÖKSAL: And more recently, things have been happening as well.] Yeah, exactly. It reemerged 40 years later, like flared jeans, you know, these things sometimes just come back. Yeah, and also, just this year, one of my really good friends, Zoë Goldsborough, she reads the paper about interspecies abduction that had become a social tradition in wild capuchin monkeys on an island off of Panama and that's a very arbitrary behaviour. There is no real clear reason why they are, why these young male capuchins monkeys started stealing baby howler monkeys. But they are they're almost wearing them like they're, like they're hats, and it shows that wild primates can just spontaneously innovate these things if the conditions allow for it. So, who's to say that wild chimpanzees also don't engage in some forms of symbolic-like cultures as well?

NIL KÖKSAL: Jake, I appreciate this. Thank you.

JAKE BROOKER: Thanks so much. Cheers.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Jake Brooker is a postdoctoral research associate studying comparative psychology in great apes at Durham University in England. And that's where we reached him.

[Saxophone and synth music playing]

CHRIS HOWDEN: What sounds do you associate with the airport? The ear-piercing squeak of a poorly maintained baggage carousel, the muffled blurt of an announcement that was definitely about your flight, but was otherwise incomprehensible, the screech of your rolling suitcase scraping along the floor because three of the four wheels are jammed? The echoing shrieks of 12 to 26 babies crying in different sections of the terminal? Well, Heathrow Airport wants you to consider the good sounds, the pleasing horror of a well-oiled baggage carousel, the soothing murmur of an announcement that probably wasn't about your flight, the general sonic ambiance of a place that makes your dreams come true by delivering you safely to a magical tropical island or your aunt's Avatar-themed third wedding, which is why it commissioned Music for Heathrow.

[Classical music playing]

But that is how it starts, and it never ends, at least not for a while. Heathrow is going to play this as part of what it has termed a mood-matching sound mix on a loop in all its terminals this whole summer. It was composed by Australian musician Jordan Rakei, who spent a lot of time recording sounds all over the airport and, in his words, used them to create something that reflects that whole pre-flight vibe. Well, that piece is really nice and relaxing, which with all due respect to the composer, does not reflect my whole pre-flight vibe, which would sound more like this.

[Sounds of babies crying, dogs barking, horns honking]

CHRIS HOWDEN: Which is exactly why I see the point of something a bit less hectic.

[Upbeat jazz music playing]

CHRIS HOWDEN: It may seem surprising, but even with the immigration crackdown in the U.S., Canada is seeing fewer asylum claims. During the first six months of this year, the Canada Border Services Agency processed about half as many asylum applications as it processed in the same time period last year, in part because of a tightening of the rules around claiming asylum. But that's not the case at the Saint-Bernard-de-Lacolle crossing in Québec. Claims are surging there. During the first six days of July, 761 asylum applications were processed, a 400 per cent increase over last year's numbers, and more than the entire month of May. Marjorie Villefranche is the recently retired director of Maison d’Haïti, an organization that helps Haitian newcomers and migrants. We reached her in Montréal.

NIL KÖKSAL: Marjorie, these numbers at this particular border crossing, we're talking about 125 asylum claims roughly a day for just the beginning of July. Does that match up with what your organization has been seeing?

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Yes, it seems quite true because we receive around 20 to 25 asylum seekers everyday.

NIL KÖKSAL: And what kinds of things are they telling you about why they're there, their fears and anxieties?

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Well, they are very anxious, and they fear that they will send them back in Haiti. So, they are trying, and an ultimate, I would say, try by coming here in Canada. Some have families here. So, they can ask for asylum because they have family. Others, just take a chance. So, this is it.

NIL KÖKSAL: Asylum seekers who enter Canada from the U.S., just to underline what you were saying there [MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: From the U.S.] normally are not able to claim asylum in Canada because of the safe third country agreement, unless [MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Exactly, unless they have...] they have a family member here. But even then, as you said, it's not a certainty, right? So, the fact that people are willing to take that chance, what does that tell you about this moment?

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: They are despaired, they don't know where to go because it's impossible to go back in Haiti, even though there's no plane going there. The only airport open actually in Haiti is Cap-Haïtien, so it's very difficult to get there. So, they cannot go back to their country, and the country is like Hell. So, they do not want to go there because, you know, they... They had no safety there. So, they are looking, and the ultimate country where they can go is here, it's in Canada, so they are trying to get there to live. And don't forget that I would say half of the asylum seekers are families. They are kids. For example, you find a family coming here, the mother, the father, and three kids. So, most of the asylum seekers are kids. So, it breaks my heart to see them like this.

NIL KÖKSAL: People are also calling your offices before they even come. What are they telling you about why they want to leave the U.S.? What are their lives like right now there?

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Their lives, actually they are afraid. And a lot of them, they say they only go to work and come back home. They don't even go to bag their groceries. They order the groceries because they are afraid of the eyes who could get them any time, any place. So, they live in fear, actually. They do not even get out from the house only to go to the work. They don't go even to church, they don't even go to Church anymore.

NIL KÖKSAL: How do you even begin to describe the impact, the psychological impact of something like that? They've fled Haiti for the reasons we've discussed and we've certainly talked about it on this program and on other interviews as well, but now they're hiding in the United States, where they are legally.

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Who could believe such a thing? It's incredible. Yes, they are hiding actually in the United States. This is the reality.

NIL KÖKSAL: We should mention there are court challenges ongoing in the United States, but as it stands right now, the temporary protection status designation and the benefits for Haitians are set to end on September 2nd, so that is what is leaving them vulnerable to deportation in addition to the climate in the U.S. that we've been talking about for some time. What do you say to them to try to quell their fears [MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Well, I...] and anxieties?

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Well, it's very difficult for us to say anything good to them because even though if they come here, the situation maybe it's more secure, but we don't know what will happen to them here, too. For example, people who don't have families here who arrive and ask for asylum. Let's say that the government applies that directive that they don't accept anymore people who, after 14 days, ask for asylum. So, what will happen to those people? We don't know.

NIL KÖKSAL: If you had the ear of Canadian officials, well, and you do in some ways now certainly, but what ideally should Canadian officials or the Canadian government be doing right now?

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: A special program for the Haitians. That happened already. They made a special program for people coming from Ukraine. They make a special program for people from Libya, from Syria. So, what can't we have a special program for people, for Haitian people? It's not something impossible because this happened already for other people from other countries.

NIL KÖKSAL: Why do you think it hasn't happened so far? Is the, is the U.S. aspect of it complicating things, or do you think there's something else at play?

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: I don't want to be mean, but I would say that it seems to be a little bit of discrimination.

NIL KÖKSAL: We were mentioning, Marjorie, that you retired recently as Director at the organization.

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Yes. After 45 years.

NIL KÖKSAL: That's a long time to do the work you were doing and clearly you care about that work. But at this moment, what was that decision like for you?

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Well, there's no retirement. From this battle, there is no retirement and I asked people from Maison d'Haïti to let me work on this problem because I know that problem. So, I didn't retire from that.

NIL KÖKSAL: You can't, it sounds like you can't [MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: I can't retire from that.] Marjorie, I'm very glad we could speak. I appreciate your time. Thank you.

MARJORIE VILLEFRANCE: Thank you, Nil. Bye-bye.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Marjorie Villefranche is the recently retired director of Maison d'Haïti, an organization that helps Haitian newcomers and migrants. We reached her in Montréal.

[Upbeat electronic and clean guitar music playing]

CHRIS HOWDEN: For the second time in recent months, a state of emergency has been declared in Manitoba. Wildfires have forced more communities to evacuate. Thousands have been displaced from the northern communities of Garden Hill and Snow Lake, but it was the smoke that caught the attention of politicians south of the border. Six members of Congress from the border states of Wisconsin and Minnesota have written a joint letter to Canadian ambassador to the U.S., Kristin Hillman, asking what Canada plan to do about mitigating wildfires and In particular, the smoke that has been drifting rudely south, saying it prevents their residents from enjoying the summer months. At a press conference today, Manitoba premier, Wab Kinew responded.

SOUNDCLIP

WAB KINEW: I've shaken the hands of American firefighters in northern Manitoba who are helping us out. And I would challenge these ambulance chasers in the U.S. Congress to go and do the same, and to hear how much the American firefighting heroes who are here, how much they loved our province. And this is what turns people off from politics, is when you got a group of Congress people trying to trivialize and make hay out of a wildfire season where we've lost lives in our province. There's no place for that in politics. If you can't get likes on Instagram from your own skills as a politician, don't bother trying to throw under people, other people under the bus during a state of emergency.

REPORTER: Do you have any concerns about being a good steward of the land and the water and the air while supporting an energy corridor, possibly to Port Nelson? There was a letter to the editor, just another reference on Saturday from a First Nations member in Manitoba who's an environmentalist and her author, who... Indicated that you're being a sellout by supporting an energy corridor possibly through Manitoba and that with the wildfires raging and climate change impacts hitting so hard that you shouldn't be doing that. Can you be a good steward of the land and the air while you're being somebody who's looking for nation-building projects? [WAB KINEW: Yes.] How, how is being in support of an energy corridor that could move fossil fuels and continue with fossil fuel dependency by enabling it, how is that being somebody who's sticking up for the rights of First Nations people who are being put at risk by the impacts of climate change?

WAB KINEW: Yeah, I was a little amused to see that headline while I was at a Sundance ceremony over the weekend. But on a more substantive level, every fire engine that I've seen, every flight carrying an evacuee, every chainsaw that a firefighter has used during this wildfire season has been powered with conventional energy. This is a part of our economy and our way of life, and it will be for the foreseeable future. And the economic horse pulls a social cart.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Manitoba premier Wab Kinew speaking to reporters in Winnipeg earlier today.

[Tapping and piano music playing]

CHRIS HOWDEN: In oceans around the world, corals are being bleached or turning white. It's a big issue and the leading cause is, unsurprisingly, warming water temperatures. But researchers in California are hoping a relatively small device they've developed, small enough to fit in a carry-on suitcase, can help shed more light on coral health. The team at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography at UC San Diego has developed a new underwater diver-operated microscope. And published details about it recently in the scientific journal Methods in Ecology and Evolution. Or Ben-Zvi is a marine biologist and the lead author of the paper. She's in San Diego.

NIL KÖKSAL: Or, with that first dive with this microscope, what was that like?

OR BEN-ZVI: In the beginning it was a bit frustrating. It was a first for me, but it was very exciting because I got to see things that me as a diver haven't seen before. Looking at microscoping that resolution on that magnification is uncomparable to anything that I've seen as a coral biologist before.

NIL KÖKSAL: Yeah, and doing it underwater, no less. [OR BEN-ZVI: Yeah.] And obviously, when most of us hear microscope, we're thinking back to our high school science class. Is that what you're taking down with you, pressing your goggles up to it?

OR BEN-ZVI: Uh, so this is exactly how I imagined it before I started working on this project. But no, a lot of things that need to be underwater are actually enclosed in a cylindrical housing. So, it's basically a tube that is waterproof, and inside of it, you can find the components of a microscope. It's just a bit disassembled, let's say that way.

NIL KÖKSAL: And how are you operating it?

OR BEN-ZVI: So, we decided to be very high tech with it, and I'm operating it with an iPhone or an iPad, which can go into, again, an underwater housing that is commercially available. And we're communicating through that controller with the computer that sits inside the microscope.

NIL KÖKSAL: In one of the photographs, we see you, it does look like you're holding an iPad in it underwater. Tell us what was happening when that shot was taken of you.

OR BEN-ZVI: So, that was from the first time I deployed the microscope underwater and I was basically trying to connect to the microscope and when I did, I could actually see whatever the microscope is imaging. So, I had a little square with the live stream of what the microscope is observing, and I could also control what illumination I want to use, what measurements I want take, recording, not recording, and obviously turning the microscope off and on.

NIL KÖKSAL: Right. And what did it reveal to you in those first moments?

OR BEN-ZVI: I think this was one of the first time I actually saw the little polyps, which are the basic units of corals, in that magnification. What I see is only two millimetres by two millimetres big. So, it's very high magnification, I saw corals moving, eating, photosynthesizing. So again, a lot of things that I haven't had the chance to see before I got this microscope.

NIL KÖKSAL: There was another microscope back in 2016. This builds upon that, if I'm not mistaken. What is this bringing to the table that wasn't there before?

OR BEN-ZVI: True. So, the previous microscope, that was called the bum, was the first of its kind. It was a first diver-operated microscope for imaging benthic organisms, so organisms that are attached to the substrate underwater. And it's from the same lab, the Jaffe Lab at Scripps Institution of Oceanography, but this time, we wanted to bridge two technologies that exist which is the underwater microscopy but also Imaging-PAM. Imaging-PAM is an instrument that is made for lab use, and it can visualize photosynthesis. And photosynthesis is something that we can't see with our bare eyes, and it gives us a lot of information about corals. So, with this new microscope, we wanted to combine those two technologies and bring Imaging-PAM underwater on that resolution. And it was important because corals are based on a very, very beneficial symbiotic relationship between the coral and the microalgae. The microalgie photosynthesizes and provides the corals with sugars, and this is what we want to capture with this microscope.

NIL KÖKSAL: To be able to study the coral in their natural habitat, what does that give you, that immediacy, you know, that taking samples would not?

OR BEN-ZVI: So, corals are very delicate and they are endangered. And we want to try and develop tools that are very non-invasive, and the microscope is one of them. We don't have to take the corals into the lab. Sometimes, we do have to sacrifice the corals when we take them into the lab to examine whatever we want to examine, or it is harder for us to keep them happy and alive in the lab. So, this instrument allows me to check them in their natural habitat without changing anything. So, they're also very sensitive to the environment. And if I'm taking them out, I might changed [inaudible] whatever they're experiencing.

NIL KÖKSAL: What you've published so far is really about introducing the technology, the microscope we've been talking about and giving examples of how it operates. What do you hope the microscope might reveal about the bleaching process in the next phase of your research?

OR BEN-ZVI: That's a great questions because, as you said, this paper was hopefully a first out of a series of papers and it was first introducing the capabilities of the microscope, hoping that we can also call for other collaborations with people who are studying other things like coral diseases or coral bleaching. I am currently trying to capture the very, very early signs before bleaching happens because we assume that the photosynthesis of those microalgae is affected before we can see the actual process of the coral bleaching, which is the explosion of those algae. So now, I'm trying to detect those very early signs and see if we can catch it before it's too late.

NIL KÖKSAL: This project was made possible through funding from the U.S. National Science Foundation. The reality is, as you and your colleagues well know, under the Trump Administration, is that there are a lot of cuts to science funding happening right now. What message, if any, do you hope your research sends right now?

OR BEN-ZVI: I hope the instrument and the potential it has will show how important it is to invest money in those kinds of studies in things that are environmental and things that bridge between technology and engineering and biology because I know marine science in general and especially now is not the top priority but we're actually losing a lot of lot of very important ecosystems and we hope that this is a call for that.

NIL KÖKSAL: Even in these serious and difficult and perhaps underfunded times, it does sound like you have a pretty fascinating and incredible job. Does it feel like that to you?

OR BEN-ZVI: Oh, yeah. I'm the luckiest person on earth. I wake up and I'm very happy with what I do.

NIL KÖKSAL: That's lovely to hear, Or. I'm glad we could speak. Thank you.

OR BEN-ZVI: Oh, thank you.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Or Ben-Zvi is a marine biologist and a postdoctoral researcher at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography at UC San Diego in California, and that's where we reached her.

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CHRIS HOWDEN: It's the end of an era in Ottawa. Cole, the last of a beloved group of feral Parliament Hill cats, has died. He was 17 years old. He was adopted by Danny Taurozzi back in 2013, when the capital's longtime cat colony closed and its resident felines were all re-homed. And Mr. Taurozzi says his years living in the now-shuttered sanctuary behind the centre block left Cole with an enduring fondness for people.

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DANNY TAUROZZI: It's a special thing to have cats on Parliament Hill. They even had, you know, unofficial informal RCMP protection. Cole was photographed literally thousands of times. He had fans from children to Prime Minister Harper to Minister Baird. One of the ministers under the Jean Chrétien government would come and talk to the cats before Question Period. One person, one staffer on the Hill told me the cats were stress relievers. They were great for, they were great for everybody. They were great for the volunteers. And though they were feral cats, they were very friendly with us. They were all adopted and they since passed away and Cole was the last one and now, he's hopefully in Cat Heaven. He better be in Heaven because if I go there, I'll file a complaint if he's not there.

CHRIS HOWDEN: Danny Taurozzi remembering Cole, the last surviving cat to have once resided in a sanctuary on Parliament Hill. As far as anyone knows, that cat colony emerged because Parliamentarians once relied on the animals as mousers, a tradition one British MP sought to resurrect back in 1993. From our archives, here's part of former As It Happens host Michael Enright's conversation with Labour MP Dennis Turner, who spoke with us from his local pub in Bilston, England.

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DENNIS TURNER: I mean, I think with any large house, I mean the White House in Washington, we know President Clinton needs to keep a cat. And, I mean, this is really larger than a large house. I mean, we are talking about a palace. Lots of rooms and nooks and crannies and eating houses and, you know, everywhere docking and little corners where the mice can do their thing.

MICHAEL ENRIGHT: Now, does this, do you think that the motion has the support of all sides of the House or is there some concern about the animal rights people, for example, you know what they...

DENNIS TURNER: Well, I think what we're looking for is a very professional mouser that really is going to act more as a deterrent.

MICHAEL ENRIGHT: Ahh.

DENNIS TURNER: Rather than to inflict any violence on the mice population. The one concern that I've got is that if we don't get full cooperation from Black Rod in the House of Lords, we shall find that this whole mice population will actually scurry off down the corridors into the Lords and we shall then hear of Lady Thatcher, possibly.

MICHAEL ENRIGHT: Oh...

DENNIS TURNER: Jumping on her red plush seat and hitting out indiscriminately with her handbag.

CHRIS HOWDEN: From our archives, that was former As It Happens host Michael Enright speaking with the late Labour MP Dennis Turner in November, 1993, about his proposal to bring cats back to the Houses of Commons and ideally, Lords.

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Jeff Grimolfson has spent many years fishing on the Fraser River in British Columbia. He's the owner of River Monster Adventures, and recently he helped reel in a genuine River Monster, a sturgeon that was over three metres long, 1.5 metres wide, and weighed more than 317 kilos, or to put it imperially, 10 feet and two inches long, five feet wide, and more than 700 pounds. Mr. Grimolfson told the CBC about the moment along with Ian Tau, one of the men who chartered the boat.

SOUNDCLIP

JEFF GRIMOLFSON: You know, we got that big bite on the rod and instantly, it felt like we were actually snagged on the bottom of the river. Like, it just would not move and it probably took probably at least two minutes before we actually realized there was a fish there. He just, he was just so big. He just sat there on the bottom and didn't care. He was like, "Oh well, I'm hooked, but I'm huge. There's nothing you can do." And then finally he's like, "You know what? I'm taking off." And then, he started swimming up river, and we probably went about two kilometres up river. And then, finally, the whole fish came out of the water and we were all just absolutely blown away. We knew right away that instantly hands down, this is by far like the biggest fish we've ever seen. So it was a special moment, but also very nerve wracking because we were only halfway through the battle at that point.

BRADY STRACHAN: Wow. Ian, I'll bring you here, bring you in here now. [IAN TAU: Sure.] You chartered the boat with a friend of yours. Now, what was it like when you realized and when Jeff told you exactly what you were up against here?

IAN TAU: Well, myself and my buddy, Glenn Wood, we've been fishing with Jeff for eight years and we've caught some big fish. Like, yesterday was quite interesting. My personal best here was 8-foot-4 and he laughs and then, all of a sudden, we get an 8-foot-8. We thought our day was done and then, all of the sudden, we hooked onto the ghost and it was like, holy schmoly, we never felt anything like this before. So yeah, it took us a lot of work and between the four of us, what a team, we brought it in. It was a little bit nerve-racking, like Jeff said. And wow. So exhilarating. It was so much fun.

JEFF GRIMOLFSON: Yeah, it was an hour-long battle.

CHRIS HOWDEN: River Monster Adventures owner, Jeff Grimolfson and fisherman, Ian Tau, speaking with the CBC's Brady Strachan.

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CHRIS HOWDEN: You've been listening to As It Happens on the CBC Listen app. Our show can be heard Monday to Friday on CBC Radio One after Your World Tonight.

NIL KÖKSAL: And you can always read more about the stories and conversations we feature on As It Happens on our website, cbc.ca/aih. I'm NIL KÖKSAL.

CHRIS HOWDEN: And I'm Chris Howden.

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AIH Transcript for July 10, 2025

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