Note: Transcripts may contain errors. If you wish to re-use all, or part of, a transcript, please contact CBC for permission. Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print. Copyright © CBC 2019

The AIH Transcript for November 01, 2019

Hosts: Megan Williams and Karen Gordon

MEGAN WILLIAMS: Hello, I'm Megan Williams, sitting in for Carol Off.

KAREN GORDON: Good evening, I'm Karen Gordon. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

Prologue

KG: Tonight:

MW: Secret weapon. They look like tear-gas canisters — but Amnesty International says the grenades the Iraqi military used on protesters aren't employed for crowd control: they're being used to kill.

KG: Pirouette pressure. Sheldon Kennedy, former NHLer and advocate against child abuse, goes from the face-off to a flying spin — and wins the CBC's figure skating show, "Battle of the Blades".

MW: Going through withdrawal. Amid all the talk of Western separation, a Saskatoon chief reminds "Wexiteers" their path out of Canada runs through some pre-Confederation Indigenous rights.

KG: The needles and the damage done. A single pediatrician is being blamed for spreading HIV in a Pakistani city by reusing syringes — but our guest says his suspension won't clear up the crisis.

MW: Up up and away. While he was in prison, his girlfriend gave him some pot in a balloon, which he stuffed up his nose — and 18 years later, an Australian man finally found the cause of his chronic sinus problems.

KG: And... it didn't fit the bill. Or rather, its bill didn't fit. Nevertheless, when two loons in Wisconsin found a drifter, they took a quack at raising a young duck as one of their own.

KG: As It Happens, the Friday edition. Radio that imagines they were surprised by their weird kid, but oh well: live and loon.

[Music: Theme]

Part one: Iraq protests, Wexit: Indigenous, loons raise duckling

Iraq protests

Guest: Lynn Maalouf

KG: Tonight in Baghdad, the crowds were larger than ever. Observers say the protests haven't been this big, or this intense, since the fall of Saddam Hussein. Iraq has been gripped by anti-government demonstrations for just over a month now. And clashes between Iraqi security forces and protesters have been deadly. At least 250 people are dead and ten-thousand others wounded. And while rubber bullets and water cannons have been deployed — there's another, more shocking weapon being used. Amnesty International say some of the deaths are due to a new military weapon deployed by Iraqi security forces: it looks like a tear gas canister, but wreaks far more havoc. Lynn Maalouf is the Middle East Research Director at Amnesty International. We reached her in Beirut.

MW: Ms. Maalouf, teargas is a common tool for crowd dispersal, but these canisters you've been looking at are different. How different are they?

LYNN MAALOUF: So this is the first time we actually see these types of canisters. They're very different, and the first people who raised our attention to this were the protestors themselves. Saying that during the course of this whole month, when security forces had been firing tear gas canisters, this was completely different. And this was then confirmed when we verified the footage and ran them through our military experts analysis and the medical aid workers we spoke to on the ground who said that the trauma that they've seen from the casualties were unlike anything they've seen in the past.

MW: They look like regular teargas canisters, correct?

LM: So they sort of look like regular tear gas canisters — except that they're ten times heavier. So you can imagine when you're firing them — and not even throwing them by hands, which was the regular way that security forces do it. If they're being fired into crowds of protesters, you can imagine the impact that it's having in the difference in the impact that is happening. Now, our military experts have told us that these types of canisters are usually used in military operations — certainly not in context to disperse crowds of protesters.

MW: You know, I know this is a graphic question to ask, but how exactly do they work once they're deployed? How are they harming people?

LM: Well, from the footage that we received and verified, and the medical scans also that we saw, what we've seen is these canisters just are lodged. They're found lodged in the skulls of the victims basically. And these have resulted in terrible, gruesome images and the wounds. And, of course, death afterwards they're found embedded in the skulls as are. So they don't fragments on impact.

MW: And are they being fired at close range?

LM: Yes, so they are being fired at close range. Tear gas canisters are supposed to be non-lethal weapons — except that in this case, the way they're being used is lethal. And the fact that they're being directed directly at protesters, and all of the scans that we've seen and the testimonies that we've received has spoken about these canisters being lodged in the heads and in the chest. So this is a serious indication that they're being fired directly at the protesters. They call them “Smokers”, by the way, not even tear gas.

MW: And what evidence do you have that directly links this to the Iraqi security forces?

LM: From the video footage, it is clear that these are being launched by the security forces.

MW: And have they responded to these allegations?

LM: No, we haven't received any response by the Iraqi authorities to date. Now, what Iraqi authorities did put out earlier in the month was an announcement — a statement — that they would open an investigation to try and establish the facts into the killing of protesters. As you may already know to date, and within the course of one month only, there is over 220 protesters confirmed who have been killed. And still, people are still going to the streets every single day — which is, I mean, an incredible act of bravery on behalf of the Iraqi citizens. The issue with the Iraqi authorities is that they have repeatedly stated that they would be launching investigations. Unfortunately, none of these investigations has ever gotten beyond the stage of just an announcement. So we've never seen an actual committee being set up which has revealed any findings — let alone being transparent about its findings or taking any action to hold any persons responsible accountable.

MW: We're seeing huge numbers of people turn out in Baghdad. And today, massive crowds — the biggest protest since the fall of Saddam Hussein. How have you seen these protests and the demands of protesters evolve since they began a month ago?

LM: From the outset, the protests were fueled namely by the youth, and specifically on the issue of unemployment. Now, let's bear in mind also that the Iraqi people have suffered from years and years of cycles of violence. Be it you know since the dictatorship of Saddam Hussein, and then going through different phases with the U.S. invasion, and then more recently, the military operation to oust the Islamic State. So the authorities and the society are dealing with a host of huge challenges. Now, as these protests are growing, they are also growing with the range of demands whereby we can see or we can you know observe more and more calls against widespread corruption. And because of that corruption, that is being given as one of the root causes of the failure of the authorities to be providing basic services.

MW: We have seen small signs of authorities responding to these protests. In a speech, Iraq's president promised early elections. He said that there would be a new election law that would allow young people to participate. And said the prime minister would be stepping down. How do you square these announcements with the knowledge that these horrific weapons are being used against protesters?

LM: The answer is really in your question. It's very difficult to believe any kinds of promises that are made when what we see is a clear, excessive use of violence against the protesters. It's just not compatible. When we see the level of violence being directed at the protesters, these new types of canisters being used, our monitoring is telling us, people on the ground are telling us that arbitrary arrests are still taking place. Security forces are going down to hospitals to interrogate people who are wounded. So there is a real disconnect between the facts on the ground and between the promises made by the authorities.

MW: Ms. Maalouf, thanks so much for speaking with me today. We'll be following this closely.

LM: Okay. Thank you very much.

MW: Bye-bye.

LM: Bye-bye.

KG: Lynn Maalouf is Amnesty International's Middle East Research Director. We reached her in Beirut. And for more on this story, go to our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Ambient]

Wexit: Indigenous

Guest: Mark Arcand

KG: Mark Arcand has a reminder for everyone about western separation. Chief Arcand is the Tribal Chief of the Saskatoon Tribal Council. Since the re-election of Justin Trudeau, the premiers of both Saskatchewan and Alberta have both been warning about western alienation. And about the outright "Wexit" supporters who want to carve out an oil and gas-rich enclave between Manitoba and BC. But Chief Arcand says they're all forgotten something. We reached him in Saskatoon.

MW: Chief Arcand, what do you think is missing from all the talk about Wexit?

MARK ARCAND: Well, I think what's missing is the consultation and the communication with Saskatchewan First Nations leaders. So as the Tribal Chief of the Saskatoon Tribal Council, we want people to come and talk to us in regards to “Weexit”, I guess, if that's a correct terminology. Because we have a direct relationship with the federal government through the Crown. And for people to speak on our behalf is not appropriate — especially when we have partnerships and relationships with the province. And, at the end of the day, we wish they’d come and ask us how we feel about it, right? Because if people want to leave Saskatchewan or Alberta, by all means go ahead. We're going to stay because the consultation hasn't happened [slight chuckle], and they don't have a voice of the First Nations people because they haven't consulted with us.

MW: Has anybody reached out to ask your opinion about it?

MA: Not from the province, no. But I believe there'd be a unanimous statement as to what I said in regards to our seven First Nations that we're not going anywhere. But how do we build a relationship and fix the relationship through relationships?

MW: So how much have you been hearing about Wexit and western separations since the election?

MA: I've been hearing a little bit about it from First Nations People. And all the First Nations people are saying the same thing. Like, nobody's talking to us. We are governments and First Nations communities, and we have a voice to speak on behalf of our people. Again, because of our relationship directly with the Crown through treaty-inherent rights. And it's based on our land, right? This was our land before the newcomers came, settlers came, and our territories were signed before provincial boundaries. So when people are speaking on our behalf and not concentrating with us — especially the non-First Nations — they should have an obligation. Because we have a great working relationship with the province. Does it have to improve in some areas? Absolutely. But we need to sit down so they can actually say the First Nations people are saying this, the non-First Nations people are saying this, and that's all we're asking. So when the non-First Nations people say it, I'm just like okay, say what you want [dry laugh]. But wait till somebody comes and asks us, right?

MW: Right. Now, the supporters of Western separatism they say that they resent the Trudeau government for disrespecting the west, and for failing to build pipelines. What would they hear from you if they did call you and ask what the Saskatoon Tribal Council thinks?

MA: Well, I think building pipelines is good. But I would say this: it has to be safe. It has to be safe for the environment — because number one, you just heard recently in the news that there was an oil spill in the State. I think it was this week — which is the Keystone Pipeline. So again, what happens? Oil falls into Mother Earth, and it starts destroying Mother Earth. When you talk about climate change and everything else, that has to be the first and foremost priority of the pipelines. How are they going to prevent leaks from happening? Because it affects people. We've already went through this through the Husky Oil spill here in Saskatchewan, where it's affected our waterways hours and hours down the waterways to other First Nations communities right from the Husky spill. And it's affected fish. It's affected everything else like that. So that's the first and foremost thing. We want them built, but we want them to be safe. And the second piece is jobs go along with that. And we support that. But again, it's going back to being safe.

MW: Now, the supporters of outright western separatism blame Ottawa for the failure to build the pipelines. But those pipelines have frequently been blocked by the courts in the recognition of Indigenous rights. Do you see the Wexit talk as a threat to Indigenous rights at all?

MA: No, I don't. I don't see no threat of the Wexit talks. Because we have our treaty-inherent rights that supersede any rights that they're talking about of separatism. Because again, we have it directly with the federal government that recognizes our laws on First Nations land. And I refer back to, again, the fact that First Nations people were here long before provincial boundaries where ever set. Our treaties were set before provincial boundaries, so that that recognition and rights piece is recognized by the federal government. And I think it should be enforced and in discussions like this. Because the federal government should also be reaching out to First Nations people and saying how do they feel about this talk? And they haven't done that as well either. And I understand because of the election that they haven’t named their cabinet. But you know that consultation should happen as well because it's working with all levels of government — including First Nations government.

MW: Given the range of treaties and acts that are connected to Indigenous land, I mean, if the Wexiters were to move forward with an attempt to separate, I mean, do you think they'd be opening a huge Pandora's box?

MA: Absolutely. But I would say to all those people that want to exit, feel free, go ahead. We’ll run the province as First Nations people if we're the only ones that are going to be here. We'll be Saskatchewan, you know what I mean? [hearty chuckle] By all means, they can they can open up their discussions all they want. If they choose to leave, we're not asking them to stay or leave. We're just saying let's work together and do this. But I know the First Nations people would definitely be happy to have their land back if people were to leave. And make sure that we could be part of the economy, and drive everything through our province.

MW: Chief Arcand, thanks so much for speaking with me today.

MA: Anytime, Megan. I really appreciate the talk. Thank you very much.

MW: Bye-bye.

MA: Bye now. Have a good day.

KG: Mark Arcand is the Tribal Chief of the Saskatoon Tribal Council. We reached him in Saskatoon.

[Music: Instrumental]

Loons raise duckling

Guest: Walter Piper

KG: For 25 years, Walter Piper has been studying loons. But this summer, he learned that you're never too old — or young — to learn new tricks. In a small lake near Minocqua, Wisconsin — Mr. Piper and his team discovered a baby loon that looked a lot like a baby duck. Further investigation revealed it was a baby duck — one that a pair of loons raised and protected all summer long. Walter Piper is a Professor of Biology at Chapman University in Orange, California — which is where we reached him.

MW: Walter Piper, what did you first think when you and your team discovered this baby duckling?

WALTER PIPER: We were astonished. We have watched thousands of loon pairs raise loon chicks. And they've always gotten it right, and had loon chicks with them. [MW chuckles] And this was the first time we'd seen anything else.

MW: And never before have you seen sort of cross-species pair up?

WP: No. And, in fact, when you see loons interact with ducklings, usually it's aggressive. They attack ducklings and view ducks as their enemies.

MW: How closely are they actually related?

WP: Very distantly related. They branched apart evolutionarily some 70 or so million years ago. Ducks are related to chickens and quail closely. And loons, on the other hand, are related to things like pelicans and penguins.

MW: Hmmm, so quite distant cousins, if cousins at all, I guess.

WP: Very, very distant cousins. They are both birds, but they are very different lineages of birds.

MW: So why do you think these loons adopted this little duckling?

WP: Well, we know from our visits to this lake that the loons had a nest that had to loon eggs in it. And we knew quite precisely when that nest would hatch. And then so much of my field assistants visited in mid-June, and we expected there to be very young loon chicks at that time. And so when she reported that there was some fluffy thing with some yellow on it with the loons, you know we were not surprised at all. But when we finally discovered that oh my gosh, that is a mallard duckling! And so what must have happened was that the loons lost their chicks. We can tell from the pattern of eggshell fragment. And, of course, they're sort of hormonally primed to care for something. And that duckling must have come by having been separated from its mother and siblings just at the right time to find a pair of loons that was desperate to take care of something.

MW: That's amazing. It’s a convergence of loss in a way. Okay, so you have this parental unit of loons and this little duckling who becomes their adopted child did. Did the duckling you know kind of take on any loon qualities in being raised by these loons?

WP: It did indeed. I mean ducklings, normally would just follow behind their mom and their mom would lead them to food. But loon parents feed their chicks a tremendous amount of small fish. And these loon parents wanted to feed the duckling fish. And it turned out the duckling was only too happy to accept the fish. So it did something that a normal duckling would never do it. It allowed itself to be fed. And fed quite greedily, and would rush over to its loon parent [MW chuckles] when the parent surfaced with food. But even more amazingly, you know, mallards are dabbling ducks. They don't dive normally. This duckling — just like its parent loons did — took on this behaviour of diving for food and actually went to the bottom of the lake and picked up things like snails. So that was the most astonishing loon trait that this mallard duckling picked up.

MW: Now, you say mallard ducks are dabbling ducks. What does that mean? They just what dip their head underwater? How is that different from diving?

WP: That's right. They never leave the surface of the water. They will up-end themselves and stick their rear ends up in the air and reach around for vegetation and a little squishy invertebrates and whatnot on the bottom of shallow shoreline areas. But they never go entirely under water under normal circumstances. But this duckling was only too happy to submerge itself just as it saw its loon parents doing. [MW laughs]

MW: That’s amazing.

WP: It’s just astonishing to watch.

MW: I bet. And I understand this duck also rode on its loon parents’ back, which I which I gather baby loons don't do?

WP: Well, baby loons actually do it for a short time. They do it for a week or two — whereas, this duckling wanted to — and actually did — ride about on its parents’ back weeks and weeks, until it was about six or seven weeks old [MW laughing]. This huge basically adult-sized mallard standing on the back of a loon It made quite a spectacle, and it almost sank its parents.

MW: [trying not to laugh] I was going to say! Those poor parents could have drowned.

WP: Right. It was a spectacle, for sure.

MW: Oh my goodness! Now beyond this particular blended family, what does this situation tell you about the animal world?

WP: It tells us that behaviour is far more malleable, or at least the behaviour of young mallards is far more malleable or flexible. And that they can adapt themselves to a very different parenting style if need be. Of course, this guy really benefited enormously from doing so — got free food from its parent that it normally wouldn't get, and also learned a new foraging technique, which allowed it to supplement its food even further.

MW: Amazing. Now, summertime is over. They've left the lake. Are you tracking them at all?

WP: We're not tracking them. I had a possible opportunity to go in and band — that is mark in some way — this duckling. But I just couldn't bring myself to do it. It would have been hard to do. I mean, it's a sweet story. I've never seen anything like this before. I didn't want to mess with this family and risk blowing them apart when they had beaten all the odds to stay together this long.

MW: Wow! Walter Piper, an amazing story. Thanks so much for sharing it with us.

WP: Thank you. Nice to talk to you.

MW: Nice to talk to you.

KG: Walter Piper is a Professor of Biology at Chapman University. We reached him in Orange, California. For more on this story — and to see photos and videos of this loon and duck family — head to our website at: www.cbc.ca/asithappens.

[Music: Ambient]

Part two: Sheldon Kennedy, Pakistan HIV

Sheldon Kennedy

Guest: Sheldon Kennedy

KG: He might have made a few spills in those early practise sessions. But former NHLer Sheldon Kennedy was still standing, right until the very end of the CBC's hockey-figure skating reality competition show, "Battle of the Blades".

SOUNDCLIP

[Music: I’m Still Standing by Elton John]

RON MACLEAN: Kaitlyn Weaver and Sheldon Kennedy are the very reason we’re still standing, week after week.

[Sound: Applause]

KG: You just heard the voice of host Ron McLean — as Mr. Kennedy and his ice-dancing partner, Kaitlyn Weaver, wrapped up their final performance last week on "Battle of the Blades". It won the public vote, and last night, the pair was awarded the top prize on the show. They'd been up against six other teams, each made up of one competitor from the world of hockey, and one well-known figure skater. Sheldon Kennedy wasn't just a famous hockey player, though. He's also known for his advocacy work, speaking out for victims of childhood sexual abuse... which he himself had experienced as a junior player. We reached a victorious Sheldon Kennedy in Toronto.

MW: Sheldon Kennedy, congratulations on your victory.

SHELDON KENNEDY: Oh, thank you very much, Megan.

MW: So what do you think put you and your partner, Kaitlyn Weaver, over the top?

SK: Well, you know, I think it was our ability to connect. And I think it was the ability of Kaitlyn and our choreographer, Julie Marcotte, to be able to communicate and understand that you know I was basically in kindergarten of figure skating. [MW laughs] I needed to learn from square-one. I mean, I couldn't even count music when I got here. And I think being able to realize that, and being able to teach at that level was really important. But I think, you know, we came into this, Megan, wanting to skate from the heart. We wanted to connect with our audience, you know? And I think we were able to do that. And that came from you know a strong partnership and friendship that was able to be bonded between us.

MW: So tell me about your final performances leading up to this win? What was going through your mind as you stepped out onto the ice?

SK: Well, I mean we skated, you know, we had Charlie Chaplin — we skated to “Smile”. That was, you know, a very heartfelt came from a perfect score. People were thinking you know how are we going to top that? Then we had to come back to R&B Week right after that, and came back with M.C. Hammer. And M.C. Hammer was a difficult one because it was just about dance. But you know, Julie said something before we went out there. And she said, you know, just that go out there and just let this be the fun one. And we had fun. And then our final skate to “I'm still standing”, I don't know if there was a better song that reflects me and reflects, you know, kind of my life for my journey than the way that song was put together. And it was an emotional skate, and everything went well that make. But I can tell you I was definitely nervous.

MW: So why did the Elton John “I'm Still Standing” resonate so much for you?

SK: Well, I mean, if we look at Sheldon Kennedy's journey, I mean obviously for the last two decades, I've been an advocate for child abuse issues. We've been pushing for law changes, pushing for changes that are around the understanding of impact and training and prevention training around child abuse issues. And I've had my own struggles. I mean, you know, I mean if we look back at my NHL career, it was marred by treatment centres, mental health issues, you know? And trying to deal with what went on in my life as a kid. And I worked hard to get to the other side. And I think the story that we were trying to trying to tell was about hope. And to show people that you know what if you're in a dark place, you can smile, you can get through this, we're still standing. And I think that that song you know we're still standing like a true survivor. You know, picking up the pieces of my life without you on my mind. I mean, those words were clear, and they were very relevant to the journey.

MW: Still standing. and also joyful, dancing, having fun.

SK: Yeah. And that's important because I think when we talk about the issues of child abuse or mental health and depression and anxiety, a lot of times we're stuck in that dark place. And it’s like, and that's what we talk about. And I think we need to celebrate, and we need to give people hope that you know what we can come out of that. And we can have that joy. We can have that fun. We can get there.

MW: Now you mentioned it was a challenge learning to keep a beat, learning to dance [SK sighs]. What was it like among all these hockey players, who I assume were facing the same challenge?

SK: Well, I mean talk about being out of your element. Talk about, you know, being out of your comfort zone. It was all new for all of us. You know, let alone counting music. It was, you know, toe picks and being able to perform. You know, being able to act, and being able to skate with a smile, and being able to connect with people. And just that fear of going there. That was a big challenge for all of us.

MW: Now you're your partner — your ice-dancer partner — Kaitlyn Weaver said that after she competed with you, she said she felt like a better version of herself because of working with you. Can you tell me more about your partnership with her?

SK: Well, I think we both ended up here at a kind of the same but different point in our life. I think we were, you know, Kaitlyn will say — and has said — that, you know, skating almost became work like her when you're grinding it out through that, you know, Olympic cycles and then World Championships on that competitive level. And, you know, and I came out of it really looking at it as an opportunity to find the love of the ice again in a different way. And she was looking to find the love of the ice again as a kid in her way. And I think they were both almost you know personal journeys that was beyond skating that I think, you know, allowed us to, you know, go to that place, really take it from the heart. And I know it sounds cliché, but that was our motto. And, you know, we don't have to be perfect, but we got to be honest. And that was really important to both of us.

MW: What do you think this competition does for the image of hockey players, and our ideas about masculinity and hockey?

SK: Well, I mean, I think it's a wonderful show. And I think being able to bring the two sports together is important, and inclusivity. There was a huge respect from both sides. You know, there was a huge respect around how difficult and how strong that you need to be, both female and male figure skating. And I think the figure skaters saw the hockey players as being able to be strong in the sense of being vulnerable. And I think that those two things were really important, and really something that was learned by the two sports coming together.

MW: Sheldon Kennedy, thanks so much for speaking with me, and congratulations once again to you and Kaitlyn Weaver.

SK: Thank you very much, Megan. I appreciate the time.

MW: Take care.

SK: Bye-bye.

KG: Sheldon Kennedy is a former NHL player, a longtime advocate for victims of child abuse — and now, the champion of "Battle of the Blades", along with his ice-dancing partner, Kaitlyn Weaver. We reached Mr. Kennedy in Toronto.

[Music: Jazz]

Pakistan HIV

Guest: Fatima Mir

KG: Fewer than 250-thousand people live in the Pakistani city of Ratodero. More than 11-hundred of them recently tested positive for HIV. Worse still, nearly 900 of those tests were of children — many of whom are believed to have been infected because of the practices of a single pediatrician. Now, that doctor has been suspended. But Fatima Mir, who was among the first to respond to the crisis, says solving it will take a lot more than one doctor's suspension. Dr. Mir is a pediatric infectious disease expert working at the Aga Khan University in Karachi. That's where we reached her today.

MW: Dr. Mir, when did you first learn there had been an HIV outbreak in Ratodero?

FATIMA MIR: Megan, this was around the middle of April. And the news broke out in Pakistan that a local physician had suspected some very sick children of being immunocompromised he had had a local laboratory test them for HIV. And about twelve tested positive. Now, those children had been tested on Chinese kits, which were not WHO pre-qualified. So when they were later retested from the Aga Khan University, eight of those were positive. And this was the official start of the outbreak.

MW: Now, you were in Ratodero in April, responding to the first reports of this outbreak. Can you tell us what those early days were like?

FM: There was mass hysteria. There was a lot of terror in the hearts of people who had never heard the word HIV. But they had all heard the word AIDS, and they equated it with sure death for their children. At that time, the government had set up a voluntary screening camp. And out of the thousands who were tested every day, quite a few would screen positive. So totally, from 25th April till roughly the middle of October, almost 33,000 people have been screened at those local clinics. And out of those, about 11-hundred have tested positive. Of those 11-hundred, almost 850 are children aged less than 15 years. So this is an unprecedented number of children who have ever been reported as HIV-positive in Pakistan.

MW: Now, that must be terrifying for the parents?

FM: Yes. What was terrible was that there was no pediatric HIV treatment centre in Ratodero at the time the outbreak broke out. So at first, it was mandatory for us, you know, to set up a pediatric clinic. And because there was none, to begin with, the physicians were newly appointed. So it's a very, very new crew. And they are learning as we go now.

MW: The New York Times has reported that, as you say, children are disproportionately affected by this outbreak — largely due to the practices of a single pediatrician, who was reusing syringes. Is that the whole story behind this outbreak?

FM: Megan, I feel it's a little simplistic to blame one man. The interesting thing is that this physician in question, I don't think he had criminal intent. In fact, a judicial committee sat on him, and they found out that he was not doing it with a criminal intent. But his infection control practices did not vary from the prevalent infection control practices among other health care practitioners. Yes, it's true that he was a very popular physician — so most of the children in this district and in neighbouring districts made their way to him. But I do know that by the time we reached Larkana, there had already been a media trial. And basically, people came to get tested because they had been to Ghanghro once or twice. So this was the level of belief that it was him who was responsible. But we all know that for HIV to spread from one person to the other, there has to be many chinks in the armor. And that's what we found in the system. All health care practitioners are poorly trained in infection control. There are no logistics in the public sector hospitals. There is very poor provision for waste disposal from hospitals. And these are all things the government is very, very committed now and is working hard to mitigate.

MW: Is this also a question of money? That people are trying to save money by reusing syringes?

FM: Absolutely. The burden of patients in any one clinic is very high. So a physician may be seeing from 30 to 60 patients a day. So this eventually means that you may cut corners. And you may be cutting corners for various reasons. You don't know that this is potentially dangerous. You don't have the logistics to practice it anyways. And people themselves are unaware, and will not demand for you to set a higher standard. So it's a mixture of things.

MW: So can you tell me what's happening now to support those people who got infected, and so many of them children?

FM: So the provincial government has been very, very forthcoming. They have adopted a policy of transparency. And they've sort of open themselves up to a lot of criticism also. And they did a brave thing. And the best thing they did was that they called in the local experts, the local academics, there is no shortage of experts within the country. But what we lack is logistics, money, and also the commitment to bring it all together. So now the government and the U.N. agencies are sort of sitting together at the same table for the first time, and trying to make a sustainable program. And not just mitigate problems for now. And not look at what we should do in the next two years.

MW: Now, HIV, of course, is an infection that has a lot of social stigma attached to it. What's being done to help people deal with that?

FM: Interestingly, Megan, in the first month or so, there was so much mass hysteria, and people were so scared they were infected and they would die that they came without prejudice. And they would swarm the clinic and say test us. And people did not feel the stigma at that time because there was so much feel. But as the fear died down, and reality set in, the stigma, and the misconceptions, and the myths about the disease. We have heard of a lot of children being victimized in schools. We have heard of people who have lost their livelihood because they’re merchants, and you know they are selling milk, et cetera, et cetera, and people will not buy from them anymore. So what the government is doing is they've involved the lady health program — women who will make household visits. And their mandate is basically maternal and child health. Government officials have gone and sat with local elders and with school elders. There will be formal training within schools. And, you know, so sort of we’re trying to mobilize the community through awareness. But again, Megan, it's going to take time, and behaviour change, and allaying people's anxieties is going to take time. And I think by that time, there will be quite a few casualties because of stigma.

MW: Well, you've got a huge challenge ahead of you. And I wish you the best of luck — you and health practitioners in Pakistan — in dealing with this. Dr. Mir, thanks so much for speaking with me today.

FM: Thank you, Megan.

KG: Dr. Fatima Mir specializes in pediatric infectious disease at the Aga Khan University. We reached her today in Karachi, Pakistan.

[Music: Sombre]

Broncos player

KG: It has been about a year-and-a-half since Humboldt Broncos hockey player Ryan Straschnitzki survived the bus crash that left him paralyzed from the chest down. And tomorrow, he will leave his home in Airdrie, Alberta and take his first overseas trip. He's going to Thailand for spinal surgery. Mr. Straschnitziki hopes to make it onto Canada's national sledge hockey team. Here's some of what he told CBC host Heather Hiscox in an interview this morning about why he chose Thailand.

SOUNDCLIP

RYAN STRASCHNITZKI: That was the best outcome for spinal cord injuries right now. And, you know, I've had a lot of people tell me that it's the best place to go. And a guy I go to physio with had it done, and he said nothing but good things. So, you now, we researched it, and it was the best place for me.

HEATHER HISCOX: Perfect. Well, listen, the surgery itself — just so people understand — the operation itself, you're having an epidural stimulation device implanted. How have the doctors explain what they'll be doing in in the surgery itself?

RS: From what I know, they'll be implanting a device below the injury that can, hopefully, rewire pathways from brain to muscle. So anything below your injury, you might be able to move again. So that's basically all I know.

HH: In your particular case, have doctors told you anything about how it could work and what it could do in your case?

RS: Well, it's not a cure. To walk again, but it's the best thing — or the closest thing — you can get to it. So for me personally, I want some core control back. And I think that would be huge even in sledge hockey body, but also in daily life. So a little bit of core control, maybe assisted standing and walking, so there's a lot of there's a lot of benefits to it. And I’m, again, excited to see what it does.

HH: So you have to stay there in Thailand for tests and tweaks, as I understand it, and then for some recovery obviously. And we have some great pictures from Carolyn's report of what your dad is packing for you. You're taking your sled all the way over to Thailand. You hope to find some ice?

RS: Yeah, I've had a few people reach out and say they have hockey teams over there, and hockey rinks inside shopping malls. So, I mean, whatever ice I can find I guess I'm going to take advantage of.

KG: That was Ryan Straschnitzki, a Humboldt Broncos hockey player who was paralyzed after a bus crash last year.

[Music: Ambient]

Weed in nose

KG: The Beatles, of course, with "Got To Get You Into My Life" — in which Paul McCartney sings, "say we'll be together every day." Three decades later, he revealed what had inspired that intense level of devotion: cannabis. "It's actually an ode to pot," he said. The subject of this story knows all about having an intimate relationship with weed. 18 years ago, he had to get it into his life — which meant he had to get it into prison where he was being held — which meant he had to get it into his nostril. Apparently, the unnamed Australian man's girlfriend smuggled some pot into the prison and sneaked it to him during a visit, inside a balloon. But the guards would examine him before he returned to his cell, so he had to stow it somewhere. The answer was as plain as the nose on his face. But when he got back to his cell, he found he had no exit strategy: the harder he tried to pull it out of his nose, the farther he pushed it in. To the point where he became convinced he'd swallowed it. Oh well, he figured. And then he forgot about the whole unfortunate incident. Over the years, he had a bunch of sinus infections and discomfort. It wasn't until the headaches started that he went to a doctor. A CT scan showed a foreign object jammed in his right nasal cavity. A thing called a "rhinolith" — a calcified lesion that had formed around the balloon of marijuana. So doctors removed it, and he's completely fine now. But all that discomfort could have been avoided — if he hadn't crammed before his exam.

[Music: Up-tempo]

Part three: Family hardware, police destroy house suit

Nigel Farage

KG: Nigel Farage is extending an olive branch — but it's a prickly one. The leader of the UK's Brexit Party delivered his first speech of the general election campaign today. In it, Mr. Farage made Conservative Party Leader Boris Johnson an offer: let's join forces to get Brexit done, and win the most seats in Parliament. And if you refuse, we'll run Brexit Party candidates in every constituency in the union. Here's Nigel Farage speaking earlier today.

SOUNDCLIP

NIGEL FARAGE: Boris tells us it's a great new deal. It is not. What we are doing here is kicking the can down the road for at least a further three years, entering in to another round of agonising negotiations. So I'm going to say this to Boris Johnson. Drop the deal. Drop the deal because it's not Brexit. Drop the deal because as these weeks go by, and people discover what it is that you've signed up to, they will not like it. The only way to solve this is to build a leave alliance across this country. And that doesn't mean just Conservatives and the Brexit party. There are Labour figures out there that I've spoken to who would more than happily stand in this election if we could put this coalition together. I hope and pray that this works. But if it doesn't, well then the Brexit party will be the only party standing in these elections that actually represents Brexit. And if that's the situation, there are two things that we will do. The first is to make sure that every house in this land is informed as to what is in the treaty and what is in the political declaration, what the costs of this are, what the time implications are. To make people truly understand the extent to which this is a sellout. And the second thing that we will do is we will contest every single seat in England, Scotland, and Wales.

KG: Listening to that opening salvo from Mr. Farage today was Marc Francois. The Conservative Party candidate, Euroskeptic, and fervent Brexiteer, didn't take too kindly to Mr. Farage's offer. Here's what he told the BBC today.

SOUNDCLIP

MARC FRANCOIS: Well, I think Nigel screwed it up. I mean if you genuinely want to work with another political party, you don't go and lie on national television and call them liar — which is what he did. He said Boris’s deal doesn't take us out of the European Union. That is not true. That's why I, and my fellow so-called “Spartans”, voted for it. We would never, ever have voted for it if we thought it kept us in. If that was meant to be an olive branch, I mean Nigel completely cocked it up. You cannot say I really want to work with you, but you're all liars. It's not a perfect deal. I still don't like paying all this money to the EU. You know, we're not in Valhalla here. But the deal takes us out of the European Union. Look, I'm sorry. Nigel is a very talented politician. But anyone who works with him will tell you he's often his own worst enemy. And his ego has got the better of him. I don't think he's going to bully any Tory MP into doing anything they don't want to do.

KG: Conservative Party candidate Marc Francois, speaking to the BBC today.

[Music: Electronica]

Family hardware

Guest: Charles Fairbank

KG: In southwestern Ontario, not far from the U.S. border, there's a town called Petrolia. And although you may not have heard of it, it's often credited with starting the oil industry in North America. It's a tale that goes back to the mid-1800s when the region's first well was tapped. And its local hardware store — Van Tuyl and Fairbank Heavy Hardware — has been around pretty much since then. It opened in 1865, before Confederation, when current owner Charles Fairbank's great-grandfather was in charge. Yesterday, it closed. We reached Charles Fairbank in Petrolia.

MW: Mr. Fairbank, how are you feeling today?

CHARLES FAIRBANK: [hearty laughing] Overwhelmed. We had our last day yesterday, and I wasn't expecting much to happen. And the place just I think the whole community walked through the door [laughing], and expressed their sorrow at the store's passing. I had no idea it had such an effect.

MW: And this is what… the community of Petrolia coming by to pay their last respects?

CF: And to buy things, of course. [MW laughs] But yes, to pay their last respects. The community of Petrolia, and the farm community outside Petrolia, Oil Springs, smaller communities in the area. Apparently, we've had quite an effect on the population, and their sorrow that the store is closing.

MW: And what are the kinds of things that people are saying is as they come through for a last time?

CF: Where are we going to go now to get stuff? [laughing] Was dominant, and also the appreciation for all that has transpired over the years with them and the store.

MW: Can you take me back to 1865, when your family's store opened? What was happening in Petrolia at the time?

CF: The emphasis of the oil — which had started in Oil Springs — had moved to Petrolia. And it looked as if Petrolia was going to be more dominant and bigger oilfield. So my great grandfather, who had established himself at Oil Springs, decided to move to Petrolia, and set up a hardware store. And so his hardware store was one that had oilfield supplies, also liquor and groceries and all that sort of thing. And then in 1874, he outgrew it and moved up to the present location where we are in the main part of Petrolia.

MW: And for people who don't know, how important was Petrolia to the early days of oil exploration around the world?

CF: It was the big one. It’s where the drillers were trained. They set up refineries, and then as Petrolia died later in terms of production, all these skilled people that knew how to drill went all over the world. So you had the foreign drillers that drilled the first well in Iran in 1980. They had been to Poland. And the remnants of the work that they did internationally is still there. You know, the kinds of technology that were developed in Petrolia.

MW: And what role did your family's hardware store play in the development of the oil industry in Petrolia?

CF: They would have been supplying a lot of the material, the steel, the pipe, their drilling tools.

MW: Now, the store is as old as Canada itself. And, you know, you've survived so much. I mean it's quite amazing. Depleting oil resources, the Depression, world wars, why are you closing now?

CF: [Hearty laugh] I was the fourth generation Fairbank. I'm probably the last Fairbank that would be interested in dealing with a hardware store. The world has changed. We used to deal with small farms here, small industries, and that sort of thing. The farms are growing in size, and so we're working on a smaller market.

MW: Now, the first ad for your family's store describes its location as Canada's West. What's your take on what's happening today in Canada's west? I mean, you know, the new heart of the country's oil industry, of course, where many fear that that industry is in deep trouble.

CF: [laughing] I don't share that feeling. I think that Canada needs that resource, and will behave responsibly. In my case, I have an oilfield in Oil Springs that’s still operating — probably the longest running oilfield in the world. And my feeling is that in terms of carbon that I need to do something to supplant the carbon that my oil might be putting into the atmosphere. So I'm planting trees. And they act as a carbon sink. So I try and balance what I'm doing that may be adding to global warming, and suck it up.

MW: Wow! That sounds like a great initiative. You're speaking to me now from your store. As you stand there, do you have a memory that stands out for you?

CF: Oh, many. As a child, my father would have meetings in the office. And he’d bring the people in from Petrolia. And so it his way of babysitting me was to take me to the meeting. So I'd be there as a kid, watching all these people talk about things that made no sense to me whatsoever, while I’d fiddle around for an adding machine and all kinds of stuff and just make a nuisance of myself. But the fact is that it was a centre for people to discuss, and plan, and do.

MW: And the building is going to remain standing, I imagine. What would you like to see happen to it?

CF: Well, I hope the building stays standing. Certainly, as long as I own it, It will. And what I would like to see is that it be understood and known as a place that reflects the whole history of this town, right from the railway to today. And the changes in things that we've made have left the structure intact. It's still a 19th century building.

MW: Mr. Fairbank, thanks so much for sharing this this slice of Canadian history with us. And best of luck with your plans for the building.

CF: [laughing] Oh, thank you very much.

MW: Bye-bye.

CF: All the best. Bye-bye.

KG: Charles Fairbank is the fourth-generation owner of Van Tuyl and Fairbank Heavy Hardware in Petrolia, Ontario — where we reached him. Yesterday, his family's store closed for the last time.

[Music: Indie rock]

New roof

KG: When it comes to home repairs, some jobs can be tricky. And then, there are other jobs where you have to be tricky. Such was the case in Glace Bay, a community in the eastern part of Cape Breton, Nova Scotia. Jeremy Locke runs a roofing and construction company there. And he and his crew would often drive by Jeannette MacDonald's home and notice the rough shape of her roof. They offered to replace it for free — but she declined the offer — until the contractor devised a plan to do a good deed. The CBC's Bob Murphy spoke to the pair about what happened, starting with Jeannette MacDonald.

SOUNDCLIP

JEANNETTE MACDONALD: Well, for the last few months anyway, it's been just spots leaking. That's why I put the tarps up there. If we get heavy rain and winds, then it would leak.

BOB MURPHY: Okay, and you say we, Jeannette. How many people live in the home?

JM: Me and my four grandsons.

BM: So when Jeremy knocked on your door and offered to replace the roof, you said no. Why did you say no?

JM: I don't like people doing anything for me for nothing.

JEREMY LOCKE: No, I understand, Jeannette.

JM: I don't like that.

JL: I understand.

BM: So you had to resort to some trickery. What did you do?

JL: Well, businesses often run raffles and draws for free items. So I had told Jeannette that our company was going to have a raffle or a draw for a free roof. And once she agreed, I had told her not to not to worry about it, that she had already won. I just, more-or-less, needed her to accept us to come. I wanted to help. That was all.

BM: So, Jeanette, you said yes then this time. You were announced as the winner of this raffle, and you decided to accept?

JM: Yes.

JL: I’d say it was the next day we had the material there. And our whole crew was donating their time. All of our guys are super proud to be on this job. Because once upon a time, Glace Bay was one of the industrial leaders. It was the Fort McMurray of Canada. And it fell apart. And I think that small businesses have to do more for our community. And I think that that will help our economy, myself.

JM: I can’t thank him enough — him and his crew. There's no words that I can describe to thank him. I'm telling you I can't. No way.

JL: I really appreciate that.

JM: They say there's people out there that does things. Well, I'm telling you, there's nobody like him. Nobody. I don't care.

JL: I was brought up by my grandparents. My grandparents also raised their own children, and then they raised grandchildren. And I seen the boys bikes in the yard. They like toys. It just really resonated with me. It hit home.

BM: Are you asking for anything in return? Is this a totally free job?

JL: Well, no, no. We're getting supper out of it. The final day of the job, I think we're gonna have a great meal. The crew will have a lot of laughs, a lot of laughs with the family. It'll be good.

BM: You're gonna whip up the meal are you, Jeanette?

JM: Oh, I am. I am. And it’s a pleasure to it.

KG: That's Jeannette MacDonald speaking to the CBC's "Maritime Noon". Her home in Glace Bay, Nova Scotia is getting a new roof, courtesy of contractor Jeremy Locke — who you also heard there.

[Music: World music]

Police destroy house suit

Guest: Leo Lech

KG: He didn't make the mess. But Leo Lech was left to clean it up. In 2015, an armed suspect broke into the Colorado man's home, which he was renting to his son at the time. The police arrived. And destruction ensued: Mr. Lech's home was almost completely destroyed. Police ripped out the windows, and the roof was badly damaged. It looked like a bomb had gone off. But other than offering him 5,000 dollars, neither the city or the police are on the hook. And when Mr. Lech took them to court — he lost. This week, a federal appeals court ruled that he's not entitled to any compensation. We reached Leo Lech just outside Denver, Colorado.

MW: Mr. Lech, how disappointing is this decision by the appeals court?

LEO LECH: Well, you know it's just absolutely extremely disappointing. Because what's happened here is this whole situation has ruined our lives. You know, I've had to borrow a considerable amount of money — over 200,000 dollars — to rebuild the house. And now I’ve legal fees on top of that. And, you know, the whole thing was just absolutely such a debacle.

MW: So take us back to that day in 2015, what happened after the suspect broke into your house?

LL: Okay, so after the suspect broke into the house, he was armed. He had a handgun. He had stolen like a couple shirts and a belt from Walmart. I mean, he had some kind of drugs on him — marijuana or speed or something. And he was running away from the cops, okay? So what happens when he broke into the house, my son's ex-girlfriend’s son was at the time in the house watching TV. And this guy broke in, and he walked in, and he said I don't want to hurt anybody. I'm just looking for a getaway car. I mean, the boy just walked out the door because by that time, his mom had come home. She was just getting some groceries up the street. So then what he did is he eventually found the keys to one of my son's cars. That was in the garage. And he started to open up the door. And the house was alarmed. So by that time, it had all gone to the police. And the police were already coming in. So he saw them real quick. He shut the door right away. And he fired a shot through a wooden door kind of just in the direction. And they called in two armored vehicles. They drove two in through the neighbour's yard, thorough their fences. They parked one in the backyard. They parked one in the front yard. They called in over 100 officers.

MW: How long did this go on for?

LL: For 19 hours, okay? And what they proceeded to do is then they used explosives, and they started firing 30 millimeter bunker buster, you know, rounds into the house. You know, so after they had proceeded to blow up you know the whole house, there's a ton of pictures that are on the Internet. You know, I mean there was nothing left of the house. They came back and slapped a condemned sign on it, okay? Turned over what was left of the property to us, okay? And, you know, the story just keeps getting better.

MW: The city offered you some money — 5,000 dollars.

LL: Five-thousand dollars. That is all they offered me. That's all they offered me. I said the family needs a place to live. They have jobs nearby. You know, the kid’s gotta go to school. They said 5,000 dollars is our final offer, quote, we are not in the insurance business, end quote.

MW: Did you receive any insurance money as well?

LL: How insurance works here in the U.S., if this is your primary residence, in other words, if I was living in the house, then they would have replaced it for what it would cost to rebuild the house to today's building codes, etc. But the fact I bought the house for my son, they had to consider it a rental, okay? So by the fact that it's a rental, it's insured for like a maximum amount, okay? And that happened to 345,000 dollars, okay? You know, there's no way I could rebuild a house in that neighbourhood, you know, up to modern building codes, and especially to the all-important Homeowners Association standards, okay? So I had to take out loans for an additional 200,000 dollars in order so I could rebuild the house.

MW: Now, the city says that the officers risk their lives, and did everything they could over, as you say, 19 hours to get this man out of your house before they went ahead with the force. But they also say that the safety of the community was paramount. Why isn't that a good enough answer for you?

LL: Well, ma'am, okay, do what you have to do, okay? If you think it takes that kind of firepower to get one person with a hand gun out, fine. But don't throw a family out in the street, okay? And make make good on what you've done, okay? I mean, like if that's what you think it took to get this man out, well, okay, you know, whatever, okay? But you can't just walk away.

MW: The armed gunman was convicted on 17 felony accounts — including 11 counts of attempted manslaughter. And he was sentenced to 100 years in prison. Isn't it important that police do whatever they can to catch someone that dangerous?

LL: Ma’am, I'm not arguing that. If they think that's what it took two to do this, okay. I personally think that these things were resolved much easier, you know, a person held up with a gun in a house is certainly not a new thing. But anyway, if that's what you think it took, that's fine. But that's no reason to throw a family homeless in the street, and not pay the homeowner, you know, so he can get his life back in order.

MW: So what are you going to do now after you've been through this ordeal and you've rebuilt your house?

LL: Well, you know, at this point, ma'am, you know I've had to defer retirement, okay? Because I really wanted to retire at 60; I was in good shape to do that. But, you know, now I've got these loans on me. You know, so at this point time, and now I have to pay legal fees, and you know I don’t know where I’m going to get that money. Of course, everybody feels sorry for me, but that's kind of where it stops. So, you know, now it becomes a point, oaky. I'm going to take this, you know, if I can get the momentum. I have a lot of momentum in this country going on now. I'm going to take it to the Supreme Court if I can get that far.

MW: Okay. Mr. Lech, thanks very much for sharing your story with us today. And best of luck.

LL: Certainly, and thank you folks. And I hope you guys stay warm up there as long as you can.

MW: Thank you. Bye-bye.

LL: All right. Bye-bye.

KG: Leo Lech's home was destroyed by police in 2015. This week, an appeals court ruled that they do not owe him compensation. We reached Mr. Lech just outside Denver.

[Music: Instrumental]

Provide Transcript Feedback

CBC would like to acknowledge the support of the Broadcasting Accessibility Fund.

November 01, 2019 episode transcript

Social Sharing

More from this episode