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The AIH Transcript for August 02, 2018

Hosts: Carol Off and Jeff Douglas

Prologue

PIYA CHATTOPADHYAY: Hello, I'm Piya Chattopadhyay, sitting in for Carol Off.

JEFF DOUGLAS: Good evening, I'm Jeff Douglass. This is “As It Happens”.

[Music: Theme]

JD: Tonight:

PC: Help wanting. Two Ontario paramedics are charged with failing to do enough to save the life of an Ontario man they were dispatched to help, after he was shot outside a Hamilton mosque.

JD: Taking into account how he was taken out of his. After TD bank abruptly ended its business with him, leaving him with massive debt, a Montreal businessman sued. And six years later, his surprise victory is generating interest.

PC: Hit the ground stunning. It's almost beyond belief that all 100-plus passengers on an Aeromexico flight survived the dramatic crash after takeoff. And one of those passengers tells us he's still feeling the impact.

JD: Mowers the pity. A glorious wildflower meadow in England that was part of Sir David Attenborough's Big Butterfly Count is now just stubble, after someone mistakenly mowed it down.

PC: One-ninth stand. Some astronomers believe there's a mystery planet out past Neptune, and they're calling it Planet Nine, which other astronomers believe is disrespectful to the former planet ninth: poor, demoted Pluto.

JD: Poor, little Pluto! And… the lack of root of the problem. A New York State woman launches a lawsuit against Canada Dry because it's so-called “ginger ale” contains no actual “ginger”. But now that I think of it, it isn't ale either.

JD: “As It Happens”, the Thursday edition. Radio that figures that is just adding insult to gin-jury

[Music: Theme]

Part one: Paramedics charged, plane crash survivor, Canada Dry lawsuit

Paramedics charged

Guest: Mario Posteraro

JD: Their job is to save lives. But tonight, two Ontario paramedics are facing charges for failing to provide the necessities of life to a young Hamilton man. Late last year, Yosif Al-Hasnawi was shot while trying to stop a fight outside a local mosque. Witnesses at the scene said that, when paramedics arrived, they dismissed the severity of his injuries, and refused, at first, to take him to hospital. Mr. Al-Hasnawi died before they arrived at the emergency ward. Mario Posteraro is the President of the paramedics union local. We reached Mr. Posteraro in Hamilton.

SOUNDCLIP

SPEAKER: They standing beside him, and they said he's okay. They saw a small cut in his belly. nd one of them, he wiped a little blood out on the cut. And he said see, you have nothing wrong. You are okay, man. Stand up. You acting out. They laughing, both of them, you know? Come on, you acting out. There is nothing, and they tried to make him stand up. And then he has no energy to stand up whatsoever.

JIM BROWN: So they believe he was seriously injured?

SPEAKER: No, no, even after he told them I have difficulty breathing. They waste 20 minutes, until we start yelling at them. We've told them, he said he has difficulty breathing. Please take him away. They said no, he's acting out, man. Stand up, stand. And you know they laughing.

PC: Mr. Posteraro, does that sound like the way you would want paramedics behaving?

MP: I don't think that's an accurate question. I think the real question is was there are varied accounts of what occurred on December the 2^nd? And the answer to that question yes. The evidence — the totality of the objective evidence — will be put before the courts. And an assessment will be made based on the evidence. There's a number of different accounts, and we're not trying to diminish what the accounts were of each individual witness. And you know I want to reinforce for your listeners that you know on behalf myself, our colleagues, and our service, you know our heart goes out to the family of Yosif Al-Hasnawi. We definitely feel for them, and this is our putting up a defense on these criminal charges in no way takes away from the pain that this family must be feeling. But to rely on one witness account from their perspective and through their lens to draw conclusions we think is inappropriate. And we look forward to looking at all of the evidence objectively during the course of this proceeding as we move forward.

PC: There are multiple reports that it took as long as 40 minutes for these paramedics to get this man into an ambulance and on his way to hospital. Are you saying that that kind of delay is all right?

MP: Well, I'm saying that you're inaccurate in the assessment of the 40 minute assertion.

PC: Based on what?

MP: We’re still getting into all the details as to the different time intervals and what occurred during the course of the call. It will be difficult for you to appreciate what actually transpired, and the activity that the paramedics went through in assessing, and stabilizing, and transporting this patient.

PC: As you say, there are multiple reports of what people say they saw, and what they witnessed, and what they told officials, and so on. My question to you is are you only relying on one of those reports? In other words, what you have heard from your own paramedics?

MP: We believe there’s subjective or objective evidence that clearly characterizes or identifies and verifies, in fact, the activities within each time interval during the course of the paramedic arriving on the scene, assessing, restraining, and then transporting the patient. But you know without you know revealing all of the details you know we look forward to presenting the objective evidence and representing these two paramedics that really do not deserve to be charged. These are two very competent career paramedics that receive positive performance appraisals by our management, by our service. Are certified on an annual basis by a leading medical authority, in fact, they were interviewed by the medical authority, who essentially holds our license as paramedics. And the findings were not to the tune of deactivation or decertification.

PC: Have you had a chance to talk to the two paramedics that have now been charged?

MP: Absolutely, I turned them into the Niagara Police Service. We have them fingerprinted. They were mugshotted. They were arrested then released on the agreement to appear on September the 11^th at 9:00 o'clock at the John Sopinka Courthouse.

PC: And how are they doing?

MP: They're distraught. I mean given the shame and blame that's been leveled against them. The accuracy of the report he has characterized them as non-caring paramedics, and that's the furthest from the truth.

PC: And more broadly, what kind of impact is this having on the other paramedics — the service that you represent?

MP: Well, I mean this is not a good day for my colleagues. It's not a good day for our service. It's not a good day for paramedics across North America. Quite honestly, this is unprecedented. It’s an unprecedented legal attack against two paramedics that these charges do not justify what they attempted to do. And just because there was a negative outcome or a death doesn't mean there should be criminal charges.

PC: Mr. Posteraro, thank you very much for taking time with us today.

MP: You're welcome. Have a nice day.

PC: Bye.

MP: Bye bye.

JD: Mario Posteraro is the President of OPSEU Local 256 — the union representing two paramedics who've been charged with failing to provide the necessities of life to Yosif Al-Hasnawi. As Mr. Posteraro mentioned, two other men have been charged in relation to the original shooting — one with second-degree murder, and the other with being an accessory after the fact.

[Music: Jazz]

Plane crash survivor

Guest: Alberto Herrera

JD: It is truly a miracle that every single person on board survived. On Tuesday, an Aeromexico flight took off from Durango, headed for Mexico City. Less than a minute after take-off, the plane crashed. A passenger on board recorded that moment, and a quick warning: we are going to play this. Some of you may find this audio disturbing.

SOUNDCLIP

[Sound: People scream as the plane bumps around]

JD: There were 103 people on board that flight, and while most were injured, no one was killed. Alberto Herrera was on the flight. He's from Chicago; he was visiting family in Mexico. We reached him in Chicago.

PC: Mr. Herrera, you are back home now. How are you holding up?

ALBERTO HERRERA: I'm fine considering I was involved in a plane accident just a couple days ago, to be honest with you.

PC: OK. Take me back to Tuesday, you get on that Aeromexico flight that is from Durango, headed toward Mexico City. When that plane started taking off, did everything seem normal to you?

AH: Yeah, everything was normal. Actually, when we were boarding the plane, it was sunny outside. While we were waiting you know 15-20 minute passes, and a light rain started — so nothing out of the ordinary.

PC: When did you realize that something was very wrong?

AH: Once the plane started taking off, we saw that it was that rain that it was actually hail. Hail with the wind. With like gusty, gusty wind, so that gusty winds started creating turbulence right as we're taking off. So right as we're starting to make our climb up, and we're off the ground, and we're going into that cloud, the wind was just going absolutely berserk. And it’s right until a certain point that the plane didn't have enough power to power up and power through it. So it slammed back down to the ground.

PC: What did it feel like when this plane hit the ground?

AH: Like the worst car crash you've ever been a part of, to be honest with you. Imagine hitting like a super hard brick wall that it just jolts you forward and backwards, but that wasn't the worst part. The worst part was the second hit, once we were sliding. Once we hit the ground and slid, I think we may have hit an embankment because that's when the engine started catching on fire. And you can visibly see the flames from the outside because I had a window seat. That's the first thing I saw when we jolted again. The flames shot up, and you can see the flames on the side. And then were still moving forward. It was until that third kind of jolt that it almost kind of like it hit the final brick wall and then it stopped. And then it was just a mad dash to get out the plane as black smoke was filling the cabin.

PC: Do you have any recollection of what you were thinking in that moment?

AH: In the first hit, you're kind of like bracing for impact, so you don't think about it. Like seconds later, like the second jolt where I saw the flames, I'm like oh god, this might be the end of me.

PC: How difficult was it to get off the plane?

AH: It was actually quite easy, to be honest with you. The flight attendant in the back opened the back doors. The flight attendant in the front opened the front doors. And then we just tried to get out as quickly as we can through the nearest door as we could. I came out the back door. The chute was open, but the chute kind of went not down but to the side. So we were jumping down from the door to the ground, which was like a six-foot jump. That's where I stood toward the back and helped the people that were behind me come down.

PC: It is miraculous that there were no deaths, but obviously dozens of people with injuries. What did you see? What kind of shape were people in?

AH: There was a priest that’s here from Chicago, he had a broken arm. I saw a lady with like she was bleeding through her nose. With the multiple hits of almost kind of like whiplash action, she probably hit her head on the seat in front of her. People were badly injured. I was one of the fortunate ones that I only came away with scratches.

PC: You know what’s amazing to me is you told this story so calmly, but I imagine being at the scene of the crash. You must have been in complete shock. What do you remember about the aftermath?

AH: Basically, I didn't go into shock mode, I went more into how can I help the people that are here mode? I was seeing people going into shock, so I was going up to them and telling them to breathe deeply, that everything was okay, that we got out. I even went to the flight attendant and I kept telling her to breathe deeply, that she did her job, that she did the best she could, just to calm her nerves. And essentially, I offered anybody who needed assistance or assistance. Like I took a person's picture and I sent it to a cell phone number of his wife because he had left his phone in his bag. He had no way to communicate with his wife, so I took a quick pic, and then sent it to his wife to let her know that he was okay.

PC: Alberto, when were you finally able to get to safety?

AH: We were sent to a hospital to get checked up, even me who only got scratches. After that, then we were let go, and I just went to the hotel and had some tequila.

PC: You had some tequila.

AH: Yeah, I had a tequila and like a big, big, big burger.

PC: What did you say to the bartender? Hey buddy, I just survived a plane crash, give me your best tequila and a good, juicy American burger?

AH: Yeah, I told him make it a double shot of your best tequila. And then my cousin was like well, we gotta get you so cloths, man. Because it was raining and there was hail, so like my clothes were drenched. We ended up going to Walmart and buying like a T-shirt and some shorts and whatnot and some flip-flops.

PC: So you had to get on another plane within days to get yourself back home to Chicago.

AH: Yeah, last night.

PC: What was it like to walk on another plane so soon after a crash?

AH: It was horrifying, to be honest with you. I wanted to get to the airport as close as I could to like the airplane taking off. So like I got there like a half-hour beforehand. Because the airport is all small, within five minutes you can go through security, and then go to your gate. And then as soon as I sat down, it got delayed. So had I go well, now I'm going to have to dwell on this for an extra half-hour, which is what I didn't want to do. I wanted to go in, get on the plane, get it over with, not dwell on it, and then just go from there. Once I got on the plane, I was a wreck. I sat down, I buckled up, and it just all the memories of us hitting the ground and then hitting a couple more times and the flames and stuff, it all got to me. And I just broke down.

PC: And when he got home and saw your family?

AH: Oh, that was great! I hugged my sister. It was awesome. I hugged my mom. It was awesome. I hugged my grandma. It was great. Listen, I am super fortunate. I only walked away with a couple of scratches on my leg. That's it. I'll deal with the head stuff as it comes. You know I'll deal with it. But from a physical standpoint, I'm okay.

PC: Mr. Herrera, thank you again. I appreciate it very, very much. Take care.

AH: Awesome. Thank you.

PC: Bye.

AH: Bye.

JD: Alberto Herrera was on an Aeromexico flight that crashed earlier this week in Durango, Mexico. All 103 people on board survived. We reached Mr. Herrera back at home, in Chicago. For more on that story — including cell phone footage taken of the moment the plane crashed — go to our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Ambient]

Manafort’s clothes

[sc]

[Sound: The glorious song that is “See My Vest” from “The Simpsons”]

JD: Mr. Burns, singing about his love for fancy clothes made from weird and endangered animals, from the "Simpsons" episode "Two Dozen and One Greyhounds". Now, of course, Mr. Burns is a cartoon villain, whereas Paul Manafort apparently just dresses like one. Mr. Manafort is, of course, the former chair of the Donald Trump campaign. He's facing charges relating to fraud and money-laundering — and the 60 million dollars prosecutors say he made working as a political consultant in Ukraine, for the country's corrupt former president. Now, these are obviously serious charges. And so far, Mr. Manafort is looking the worse for wear — or rather, the worse for what he wore. By now, we've already heard ample evidence that the consultant has extravagant taste. A landscaper testified that Mr. Manafort has a bed of red flowers spelling out an "M" on a property in the Hamptons. The head of a TV-and-Internet company said Mr. Manafort had paid two-point-two million dollars over five years to wire up various properties. And further testimony revealed Mr. Manafort was, quote, "a very good customer" at House of Bijan in Beverly Hills — which actually calls itself "the world's most expensive store". Does it get more ridiculous? It does. The manager of the New York luxury menswear store "Alan Couture" told the court Paul Manafort was one of his top five customers. And a couple of invoices suggest that's very true. On one, there's a charge for an 18-thousand-dollar "python jacket". Python not a brand — the snake… the actual snake. And on another, 15 thousand bucks for a custom-made ostrich jacket, plus a 95-hundred dollar ostrich vest. Of course, what's most relevant here is that all this cockamamie stuff was paid for through wire transfers from foreign bank accounts, which, like the ostrich jacket and vest, doesn't look good. Still, there's a lot of trial left, so we'll see whether the clothes unmake the man.

Canada Dry lawsuit

Guest: Aaron Manahan

JD: For a lot of us, Canada Dry Ginger Ale is not just a soft drink. We really like it. It's an elixir that cures queasiness, hangovers… Piya… and an upset stomach. Plus it's legitimately medicinal — it has the words "made from real ginger" right on the can. Well, friends, get yourself a ginger ale and sit down: a recent lawsuit filed by a woman named Julie Fletcher in New York State alleges that Canada Dry does not actually contain any ginger — At all. The lawsuit claims that Ms. Fletcher, quote, "believed Canada Dry was made using ginger root and was, as a result, a healthier alternative to regular sodas." Unquote. Aaron Manahan has been following this case. It's on his beat, after all: Mr. Manahan has reviewed hundreds of sodas on his website, TheSodaJerks.net. We reached Aaron Manahan in Houston.

PC: Mr. Manahan, what do you make of this lawsuit over Canada Dry Ginger Ale?

AARON MANAHAN: I feel a little bit of each side. I see where the person claiming the lawsuit is frustrated because on the can of Canada Dry, it does say “made from real ginger”. And you can see something — the words ginger on something — and assume that it has ginger in it. On the other side I see where Canada Dry probably took whatever legal ways they needed to to put “made from real Ginger” on the can. In no way does it say there is ginger in it. It just says that it is made from real ginger.

PC: You have a can with you right now?

AM: Oh yes, mam. I do enjoy Canada Dry. I don't use it for the ginger properties. I have other other ginger sodas I drink for nausea relief because Canada does not have an amount of ginger in it that would cause me to feel better.

PC: OK. Can you do me a favour? Can you rotate that can, if it's closed, and look at the ingredients list for me and see if it says ginger there?

AM: Well, it's a short list, so I'll read it if that’s okay?

PC: Go right ahead.

AM: we have: carbonated water, high fructose corn syrup, citric acid, sodium benzoate, natural flavors and caramel colour.

PC: No ginger.

AM: No ginger on the ingredient label. And I do know that there are other ginger ales out there that use ginger, and have ginger in their ingredients. They'll tell exactly how many grams of ginger they use.

PC: So in the lawsuit filed by Julie Fletcher, she says one factor in her confusion about the product really stems from this 2011 commercial where this hunky ginger farmer pulls a ginger root out of the ground, and then was pulled up through a cooler of Canada Dry. Do you think the public is being misled by advertising campaigns like this?

AM: I do remember that advertising campaign, and I can say as someone who was regularly drinking Canada Dry at that time, they sold me again on a product I was already using. It was a very effective advertising campaign on me. And I'm unaware of how much ginger is in Canada dry compared to other ones. It is misleading in that regard. But at the same time, I'm sure ginger is used in the creation of the soda. Maybe the advertisement shows that you would think more ginger would be in Canada Dry. So in that in that regard, yes that is misleading.

PC: I'm glad you brought this up because there was a similar lawsuit in Missouri, which was dismissed in June. That said lab tests reveal that Canada Dry does not contain ginger. But the company argued that ginger is used to make the natural flavoring in the drink. Can you explain what this could mean?

AM: Well, in creating the flavour of Canada Dry, they use the ingredient of ginger. That doesn't necessarily mean that ginger is in the drink itself. It just means that it was used in the creation. I'm not saying they’re doing this, but you could run your water over ginger, and use the water that's on the other side that’s passed through the ginger. That would technically be using Ginger. They could dig an extract from the ginger and put that in the actual soda itself. Both are using Ginger without actually including it in the beverage.

PC: So as you said, you know you kind of get where Ms. Fletcher is coming from. But do you think she's got any chance that she'll win in court?

AM: I do not. That said, I review sodas; legal is not my forte. But I've seen a little bit of Internet chatter here and there, and at one side the lawsuit seems frivolous. Why are you suing about this? Of course there's no ginger, etc, etc. On the other side, how do you get this changed? Even if the lawsuit causes them to write something on the can along the lines of “product does not contain ginger”, or “less than whatever per cent ginger in this product”, or “not to be used for anti-nausea purpose”. That is a win. Now, I don't think that will happen either. But you want that changed, so words like “made from real ginger” are no longer as confusing to the consumer.

PC: How do you think companies like Dr, Pepper Company, which is the umbrella company to Canada Dry be held accountable over this?

AM: To me, this is just a level of advertising that is deceptive but legal. I'm sure whenever they put the words “made from real ginger” on their can, that they checked with whomever they needed to check with. Hey, can we say this? Do you use it? Yes, we do. Then okay, you can say this. And I'm sure it markets well for them. People probably pick up Canada Dry — or ginger ale in general — thinking that it’s going to really soothe their stomach. The harm of that is one, it doesn't because this is just a mass-produced, manufactured soda. I enjoy it, like I said. But I'm not reaching for it for medicinal purpose.

PC: I was going to say, where do you turn to when you've got an upset stomach? what ginger ale do you reach for?

AM: I reach for Reeds Ginger Ale or Reeds Ginger Brew. Again, or you can just go for gender tablets. But I like ginger ale as well. But a Reeds Ginger Ale, you can see the sentiment of the ginger floating in it. There's no question that there's ginger in that soda.

PC: Aaron Manahan, thank you. Enjoy that can of pop that you've sitting beside you.

AM: No problem.

PC: Bye bye.

AM: Thank you. Bye.

MY: Aaron Manahan reviews pop at The Soda Jerks-dot-net. We reached him in Houston. So he propably doesn’t call it pop, does he? And you can read more about that story on the "As It Happens" website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Indie rock]

Part two: Bank fight win, meadow destroyed

Bank fight win

Guest: Hossein Pourshafiey

JD: It took him six years, but a Montreal businessman did what no one said he could: he beat TD Bank in court. In 2012, Hossein Pourshafiey was running a money-exchange business, when he got a letter from TD. Without giving him a reason, the bank said it was closing all of his accounts, personal and business. Leaving the Iranian-Canadian owing hundreds of thousands of dollars — with just weeks to pay it off in full. So he fought back. We reached Hossein Pourshafiey in Montreal.

PC: Mr. Pourshafiey, take us back to 2012. You're running your money exchange business when you get this letter from T.D. Bank. What exactly did the letter say?

HOSSEIN POURSHAFIEY: The letter says that I have 30 days to close my business accounts, and 60 days to pay my line of credit and home equity line of credit. And there was no reason whatsoever.

PC: And how much money did it say you had to pay the bank back?

HP: Almost $700,000.

PC: $700,000 Canadian dollars?

HP: That's right.

PC: And no reason? It just said you owe us this money. Here's your timeline. Thank you. Sincerely, Person A from TD Bank.

HP: Exactly.

PC: And so when you read that, how did you react?

HP: It's like being hit by a sledgehammer. It was not easy.

PC: Did you have any more understanding at the time about why you might get a letter like this from TD?

HP: I’m involved in the Iranian community, and my currency exchange gives the service to the other community besides Iranian too. And I’m also involved in the cultural centre that helps all the newcomers from one Iranian and other communities. What happened that the people come to me before and they complained that TD Bank closed their account without giving any reason. And I've been defending the bank and saying that you might have wrongfully informed something. And the bank will not close the account just like that without giving you the reason, until I received a letter from the bank myself.

PC: And so what did you do? You get this letter, what's your next step?

HP: Well, the only thing is that I had to call the bank. And bank the bank at the time was closed. The next morning, I went to my bank branch. The bank manager knows me very well. Everybody in the bank knows me very well. And he was surprised. I said you are the bank manager and you were not aware of this matter? He tried to call, and there was no answer. He left a message. And the same phone number that he gave me that this was on the letter that I have to call if I have any questions. And this situation was going on and on, and there was no clear answer why they closed my accounts.

PC: So you find a lawyer who is willing to help you out, and you take the bank to court. What was the basis of your case against TD?

HP: The basis that was the closing my account? They put me out of the business, and they destroy my life. When I came to Canada in 1972, I came with the hope and the resolution. I had the hope that I'm coming to the country that I will not be discriminated against. I had the resolution to succeed, and I did in my life and in my business. I’ve raised five educated kids. And I was successful in my business. I was doing my due diligence, according to the law. The same people that monitor the bank monitor me. They audited me three times. They had found nothing wrong with my services and my due diligence. And the bank comes just like that shut the door on me. It was hard on me.

PC: And so what did you specifically sue them for?

HP I sued them for the losses of business, and the stress that they put on me. I did not want to sue. I wanted my bank account back and my business back. And just tell me what did I do wrong?

PC: As I understand it from the reporting on this, in court, the bank eventually explained it ordered the account closures because it wasn't comfortable with the transactions conducted with Iran in February of 2012, given that Canada had economic sanctions in place at that time.

HP: Exactly, exactly. Those transaction, as a matter of fact, they had the report. It was reported that it was among those periods that I had been audited by the government. And there was nothing wrong with those.

PC: In your opinion, was there any justification here for being concerned with your Iranian dealings?

HP: When you are doing business, you have to be concerned. And there is a clause in our due diligence that it says know your client. They should know their client who they are dealing with. The same way that I was dealing with the people that I know how they are, and what type of the transaction I do.

PC: It took six years. The court decides in your favour. You get almost fifty thousand dollars in damages, and TD is to pay your legal fees. Did you ever doubt that you would win?

HP I had hope always when started it and when I came to Canada. It's a country of law. When you do things right, according to the book, always the law is behind you.

PC: What had your life been like during those six years of trying to get an answer to the questions?

HP: There is no word that I could explain to me and my family that I went through in past six years. And I found that it's unjust because of the decision of the bank.

PC: If you could speak to officials, the head of TD Bank right now, what would you say to them?

HP: Everybody could make a mistake. They’ve learned. I am in the business man too. It's in mutual interests to look into my case not by the branch, but in the higher level. And show the good faith and reopen my account. And we have both mutual benefit.

PC: Would you still bank at TD now?

HP: Definitely, I will do. If they open my bank account, I will do.

PC: Help me understand that. After all that you've been through with this bank.

HP: I’m a student of Nelson Mandela and the Gandi.

PC: Meaning that you are willing to forgive them?

HP: Yes. that is what the society needs these days. The whole hardship around the world that's what we need.

PC: Mr. Pourshafiey, thank you very much for speaking with me.

HP: I appreciate it. Nice talking to you.

PC: You too. Bye.

HP: Thank you. Thank you.

JD: Hossein Pourshafiey recently won a six-year court case against TD Bank, after it refused to explain why it cancelled all of his accounts in 2012. Mr. Pourshafiey in Montreal. For its part, TD tells "As It Happens" the bank is, quote, "disappointed with the outcome", and is reviewing legal options.

[Music: Ambient]

Jim Acosta

JD: Ivanka Trump was asked today if she considers the press the "enemy of the people." That, of course, is a phrase her father — U.S. President Donald Trump — has used to describe the press and reporters. Ms. Trump said she does not consider the press the “enemy of the people”. Later on in the day, at the White House press briefing, CNN correspondent Jim Acosta asked press secretary Sarah Sanders to disavow the phrase. She did not — and instead, she gave instances of media attacks on her, in the past. Mr. Acosta followed up.

SOUNDCLIP

JIM ACOSTA: You did not say in the course of those remarks that you just made that the press is not the enemy of the people. Are we to take it from what you just said, we all get put through the ringer. We all get put in the meat grinder in this town, and you're no exception. And I'm sorry that happened to you. I wish that had not happened. But for the sake of this room, the people who were in this room, this democracy, this country, all the people around the world are watching what you're saying, Sarah. And the White House for the United States of America, the president of the United States should not refer to us as the enemy of the people. His own daughter acknowledges that. All I'm asking you to do, Sarah, is to acknowledge that right now, right here.

SARAH SANDERS: I appreciate your passion. I share it. I've addressed this question. I've addressed my personal feelings. I'm here to speak on behalf of the president. He's made his comments clear.

JD: After the press briefing, Mr. Acosta tweeted that he had, quote, "walked out of the end of that briefing because I am totally saddened by what just happened." Unquote. He also spoke with his network, CNN.

SOUNDCLIP

JA: You know, it's unfortunate that the position that we're all in right now. And I'm standing in this briefing room right now. There is no government official here, but I'll say that the press is not the enemy of the people. And you know I think you know maybe we should make some bumper stickers, make some buttons. You know maybe we should go out on Pennsylvania Avenue like these folks who chant “CNN sucks” and “fake news”. Maybe we should go out — all journalists should go out on Pennsylvania Avenue and chant. We're not the enemy of the people. Because I'm tired of this, honestly Brooke. I'm tired of this. It’s not right. It’s not fair. It’s not just. It is un-American to come out here and call the press the enemy of the people. And Ivanka Trump knows that. I don't know why her father doesn't. And I don't know why this press secretary doesn't. I mean she got yelled out at a restaurant in Virginia. I'm sorry about that. I feel badly for her that that happened. And that a comedian at a correspondent’s dinner said some unpleasant things about her. I'm sorry about that. She ought to hear some of the things that were said to me the other night in Tampa. She ought to read some of the things that are said about my colleagues on CNN on a regular basis. It would be nice if we all lowered the temperature a little bit. But at the very least I think we should all be able to agree on one thing, and that is the press is not the enemy of the people.

JD: CNN's Chief White House Correspondent Jim Acosta speaking earlier today on that network. In a tweet later today, Donald Trump said, quote, "They asked my daughter Ivanka whether or not the media is the enemy of the people. She correctly said no. It is the FAKE NEWS, which is a large percentage of the media, that is the enemy of the people!"

[Music: Percussive]

Planet Nine

JD: It was twelve years ago this month, the word "pizzas" was eliminated. Not in general, of course, you can still use it in conversation, or on the phone when you’re speaking with a pizza place. But it was struck… neigh, it was ripped from the mnemonic we used to use to remember the order of the nine planets: "My Very Educated Mother Just Served Us Nine Pizzas." That's Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune...and Pluto. Poor Pluto. As you know, and as I'm sorry to bring back up once again, in August of 2006, the International Astronomical Union redefined planethood — and Pluto, poor Pluto, did not make the cut. A lot of scientists were angry about it. And apparently, they still are — judging by the Planet Nine kerfuffle. In 2014, astronomers suggested a mystery planet was out there, beyond Neptune, affecting the orbits of some distant, small planets. A, quote, "massive perturber", in scientific parlance. But despite its inferred enormousness, no one's actually found the massive perturber yet. They have found a name for it, though: "Planet Nine". And some scientists are not at all into that. In a letter published in the Planetary Exploration Newsletter this week, those scientists argue that, first, they're nowhere near convinced that Pluto — the former "planet nine" — should have been demoted at all. And second, quote, "...given the incredible accomplishment of the discovery of Pluto...by planetary astronomer Clyde W. Tombaugh in 1930, we the undersigned believe the use of the term 'Planet 9' for objects beyond Pluto is insensitive to Professor Tombaugh's legacy." Unquote. 35 scientists signed that letter, and suggested it instead be called "Planet Next" or "Planet X". And it's hard not to take their point: Pluto, poor Pluto, is there, but it lost its status. And now they want to slap that title on a planet that may not be there. Still, Planet Nine is definitely a massive perturber — because a lot of people are massively perturbed.

[Music: Indie rock]

Destroyed meadow

Guest: Ed Dolphin

JD: Every day, Ed Dolphin would walk his dogs through a gorgeous wildflower meadow — bursting with flowers like orchids and ivy buttercups. It was also a vibrantly colourful home to several species of insects and birds. One of the reasons Mr. Dolphin visited the meadow daily was to check on the butterflies. He's been keeping track of them for Sir David Attenborough's Big Butterfly Count, which is a national survey that asks the public to spot and record different species of butterfly. But one day, Mr. Dolphin realized that something had gone very, very wrong at the meadow. And he says what he saw "horrified" him. We reached Mr. Dolphin in Sidmouth, England.

PC: Mr. Dolphin, can you describe for me the moment when you realized that something had happened to this meadow?

ED DOLPHIN: Well, I was horrified and upset. Because the day before, I'd been walking through there was a lovely flower meadow full of butterflies. And then I was presented with a grey desert basically.

PC: Everything had been mowed over?

ED: Yes.

PC: And before this incident, when the meadow was lush and beautiful, how many butterflies would you see on a daily basis?

ED: Well, walking my dogs, I would see at least 30 or 40 just in a short walk — bout eight to ten different species each day.

PC: And how many are you seeing now?

ED: Two or three — all of the same species. There's only one species left.

PC: The meadow I think you described as lovely before it was mowed over.

ED: It's a beautiful place. It's actually the grounds of what was a very large Victorian house. And it then became a hotel. And then it became the local council offices, but they've kept a lot of the gardens and the parkland around it.

PC: And how would you describe what it looks like now?

ED: Well, it's starting to recover. It's gone green now at least. One of the significant features is the trees. It's a magnificent collection of trees in there. So they're okay. But it's quite sad now compared to what it was because you know to be able to walk through and have butterflies flying around you all the time is very pleasant. But butterflies and other insects in England are all under pressure. There's been an enormous decline in butterflies in England in the last 30 years.

PC: In a statement, the East Devon Shire District Council said, this is a quote, “We regret that one of our operatives misunderstood the instructions he was given, and cut the area by mistake.” Instead of just cutting some pathways in a flat area to help those using the park for walking through. They added that this shouldn't have happened, and they'll take extra measures that this doesn't happen again next year. Mr. Dolphin, what do you think of their response?

ED: Well, it’s interesting because there’s another bit. But the first thing is this is the second year they've done it. They did it last year, and I complained last year. But nothing happened. And it's happened again this year, so hopefully the amount of fuss is being generated through the national media in England means that next year they will be much more careful. But also their statement goes on to say that one particular area that has been prepared as a flower meadow wasn't cut. Well, I'm afraid that's not true. It has been cut. But the person's framing that reply for them I presume hasn't actually been to have a look. And how big of an area are we talking about that was cut?

ED: It’s between six and nine acres.

PC: And when you complained last year, and said Look, you're not supposed to mow that meadow. Did they give you any assurances last year that it wouldn't happen this year?

ED: No, the meadow should be cut. To manage a flower meadow, you do need to cut it. But you need to cut it at the end of August, not at the end of July. Because a lot of the wild flowers will still setting seed, and no seeds now won't be set, so there'll be fewer seeds for next year.

PC: You were counting butterflies here for David Attenborough's Big Butterfly Count you know what's been lost now?

ED: Well, I can say what I know was there before. But you know to do it properly, I’ll have to go and do it somewhere else. Or I'll just record what's there, which is just a couple of large whites. The Big Butterfly Count is big. It's a citizen science project, whereby hundreds of volunteers all over the country go out for a certain period of time and just record the butterflies that they see. Because, as I say, butterflies are under pressure in Britain, and so the butterfly conservation organisation, along with David Attenborough, are trying to get some hard data as to what there is about them so they can keep a record.

PC: And so without being able to I guess accurately count the butterflies in this well now former meadow I guess what effect will that have?

ED: Well, one reading out of thousands won't affect the Big Butterfly Count. But it's not so much the number of butterflies it’s the range of species because there were ten different species of butterflies readily seen in that parkland meadow beforehand. And now we're down to one. All the butterflies will have survived and flown off somewhere else.

PC: But it is a bit of a shame, isn't it.

ED: Well, it is a real shame because the park itself is a beautiful part of Sidmouth. Sidmouth is a beautiful town, which is why I live here. And we've got a lot of citizens in the town who are very keen on environmental matters. We've got several environmental organisations in the town that do an awful lot. They're just sad that the local council aren't supporting them in this particular thing.

PC: And as you said, this is the second year that this has happened. They have given assurances in a statement that next year they'll do better. What confidence do you have in that.

ED: Well, I have quite a lot of confidence in that because they've had so much attention drawn to them we really can't have this happening again because it makes the council look very bad.

PC: Where will you be going to watch butterflies the rest of this summer?

ED: In my garden. There is just half a mile away there is a nature reserve. There's another large park in Sidmouth which runs along the River Sid. But compared to when I was a child, there is a fraction of the butterflies about in the summer in England. They're becoming rare, which is a bit of an indicator of just how our environment is being degraded.

PC: Mr. Dolphin, thank you for talking with me.

ED: Thank you. Happy to talk.

PC: Bye bye.

ED: Bye bye.

JD: Ed Dolphin, an amateur naturalist, and treasurer of the Sidmouth Aboretum. We reached him in Sidmouth, England. If you want to see photos of the meadow and the butterflies, go to our website: www.cbc.ca/aih.

[Music: Ambient]

Newfoundland flotie rescue

JD: 16-year-old Andrew Howell was at his family's cabin at Northern Bay Sands Park in Newfoundland, when his mom came running towards him. Fast. Calling for him to get some rope. Very quickly, he learned what that rope was for: a girl was on a unicorn-shaped raft, in the ocean, she couldn't get back to shore. Afterwards, Mr. Howell told CBC reporter Malone Mullin what happened.

SOUNDCLIP

ANDREW HOWELL: I run down to the small beach as fast as I could, and I look around and I see what looks just like a little girl out floating and waving her arms looking for help, right? Someone greets me on the beach and say are you with the park? And I say no, I'm not with the park. My dad looks at me and he's down on the beach and he says are you getting in? Before I say this, I should back it up and tell you that my mom said don't you dare get in that water. She was terrified that if I went out, I could be in serious trouble. Anyways, so I got out, I took my shirt off, and my dad said I'm coming out with you. So he got in up to his waist and he said Andrew, I don't know if I can do this. So I jumped in right away started swimming out. At this point, all I could see was a little girl on a on a little floatable raft. I was thinking man this girl must be must be terrified. So I swim out as fast as I could. And in this freezing, freezing cold water. And I get about halfway and I got a turn over on my back. And I finally keep going, and I get most of the way and I see that her dad’s behind like on the other side of the float trying to push her in. But I was very lucky. There was a lifeguard that came out on a boogie board, and another lady, I can't remember the names at the moment. But without them, and the man's help as well, there is no way that I'd be able to do that myself.

JD: That was Andrew Howell speaking with reporter Malone Mullin, about a rescue he was involved with earlier this week. The CBC also spoke with Red Cross water safety trainer Bryan Harris, who cautioned against using toy rafts in the open ocean — where winds and waves can take them out fast.

August 2, 2018 episode transcript

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