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The AIH Transcript for April 3, 2019

Hosts: Carol Off and Jeff Douglas

Prologue

CAROL OFF: Hello I'm Carol Off.

JEFF DOUGLAS: Good evening. I'm Jeff Douglas. This is As It Happens.

[Music: Theme]

JD: Tonight...

CO: Silent partners. In the island nation of Brunei, gay sex has just become a crime punishable by stoning until death -- which has a Bruneian refugee seeker in Canada telling his friends that their love would be safer unexpressed.

JD: Out of office reply. Algeria's long time president steps down, in response to weeks of protests -- and now, demonstrators have their sights set on the rest of that country's establishment.

CO: Symptoms of a larger problem. An autopsy shows how a 7-year-old Guatemalan girl died while in U.S. custody -- our guest says border protection staff should have seen the signs.

JD: The unkindest cut. An Ontario chief warns about unscrupulous exploitation after a First Nation agrees to pay a million to a consultant who helped them get federal housing money.

CO: Perfectly armless. To corporate types, the Patagonia vest has become part of the uniform -- but the clothing company has decided not all corporations are a good fit.

JD: And the feeling of whelplessness. A Toronto woman tries to attend day "puppy yoga" class -- in which downward dogs are accompanied by actual dogs -- only to get barked out by the humans. As It Happens. The Wednesday Edition. Radio that warns this story does not have a hairy tail ending.

[Music: Theme]

Part 1: Gay asylum seeker in Vancouver fears he would be stoned to death in Brunei

Brunei gay law.

Guest: Shahiran Shahrani

JD: Shahiran Shahrani has a new reason to worry. Mr. Shahrani is an asylum seeker from Brunei. He fled to Canada last year, after being put on trial for questioning Brunei's government on Facebook. Mr. Shahrani is also gay, and when he left that was already a crime. Today, however, the Sultan of Brunei brought a new punishment for gay sex into force. That punishment is death by stoning. We reach Shahiran Shahrani in Vancouver.

CO: Shahiran what message does this stoning law -- what is the message it sends to gay people in Brunei?

SHAHIRAN SHAHRANI: Well we've always expected this, right. And when we were kids we were indoctrinated in religious school, and we were thought that this sort of thing would happen -- and to welcome it at the golden age of Brunei. Not everybody bought into that -- like you know especially people like me. I know it was coming. I just didn't expect it to come so soon.

CO: So what does it mean for friends of yours -- for gay people in Brunei whom you know?

SS: A lot of them are obviously scared. They feel threatened. Because homosexuality has always been a crime in Brunei, but nobody has ever been charged with it. And back then the punishment was like a jail sentence. Now they ratcheted it up. The likelihood of them getting caught -- because the scrutiny is much higher -- it's going to be much higher. They don't feel threatened in that they don't feel that they will incur the ultimate penalty of stoning because the burden of proof that is so high. But then I would remind them, they don't have to go all the way. As long as they could find maybe the Grindr app on your phone -- it's not that well-defined with what burden of proof they would need. But that alone could land them in jail for ten years. And that is horrendous. I'm a gay man -- the fact that I said that I am a gay man might land me in prison for ten years -- it just boggles the mind. But taking my situation -- if I ever were to go back to Brunei, I'm now kind of famous because I've spoken out on CNN and I've told everybody that I'm gay -- that is enough for the burden of proof. Burden of proof is like there are four witnesses to you having gay sex or you yourself confess to being gay. So if I were to go back, I'd be liable to be stoned to death.

CO: And you know it's interesting when we asked if you wanted us to protect your identity -- to not use your real name -- and you insisted that we use your real name and your identity, and that you want to be out there. Are you making a statement? Why is it so important that the world knows who you are as you make these kinds of remarks about Brunei and its policy?

SS: Because I remember back in 2014 when Brunei first announced the laws, right. There were protests all around the world. And me as a Bruneian when I saw those protest, I got angry. Like you know I got angry at Westerners. I just went like, oh these people don't know what Brunei is. Just bring a map and then ask them to point out where Brune is. As a Bruneian I felt offended. Even though I knew that these protests were for my benefit. And then over the years I have thought about it, and I realized it's because it's not a Bruneian thing, right. It's not a Bruneian saying these laws are wrong. It's not part of our character as a country. We've always been carrying-care for nation. And it's totally out of character for our country. And if a Bruneian somewhere could see that it's not Westerners -- it is not outsiders -- criticizing laws, it's another Bruneian (then) they could feel like 'actually yes' -- they can identify with that. And 'yes, I don't agree with it as well.' And that could help see some change in the country that there are other people out there who think like them.

CO: But you believe that if you went back you would be stoned to death.

SS: I would, I think. Well I left the country because I was charged with sedition over a Facebook post criticizing the government. And in that trial they've shown that they were determined to make this show trial. They were determined to put me behind bars. And I saw that determination. I never experienced it. To me Brunei is such a small place it feels like I know everybody -- even the Sultan. I feel like you know they are part of my family. And I couldn't imagine my family -- even though they warned us -- like you know, 'oh we're are going to chop up your hands if you...' I never connected that that could happen to me because I'm a Bruneian [inaudible]. But I've been through that process, I escaped the country because of it, and I'm here to say -- yeah that could happen. I’ve seen all of this. They are not the kind of Bruneians that we see everyday on the streets. They have an agenda. They want to push the country towards these backward Sharia laws. They want to prove a point.

CO: You're living in Vancouver now and you're hoping to be accepted in Canada as a refugee. But do you miss your country?

SS: Of course I do. It's a beautiful country. [Chokes up] I get like this when people ask me to speak about my country. It's a beautiful country. It's in Borneo and it has some of the most ancient rainforest in the world. And my grandfather taught me forest law. How to walk around the forest and how to relate to nature. I do miss it. [Cries] I'm sorry. Yeah I do miss it. It's a beautiful place.

CO: I'm so sorry.

SS: I find that every five interviews I break down a little.

CO: It's understandable, don't apologize. People love where they come from and I'm sure you miss your family too.

SS: I do.

CO: What are you telling friends back home?

SS: Yeah I'm telling them that they could leave like I did because if the new law is coming in -- they can seek asylum in any western nation -- places like Australia. They have condemed Brunei and these laws. And to think about that Bruneians -- there's only 500,000 of us -- if all of us left the country and sought asylum elsewhere, we would be easily absorbed. Like you know there's not many of us anyway.

CO: Shah I hope everything works out for you. I'm sorry all this has happened. But I do appreciate you speaking with us. Thank you.

SS: Thank you so much.

JD: Shahiran Shahrani is an asylum seeker from Brunei. We reached him in Vancouver. And we have more on Mr. Shahrani's story on our website: cbc.ca/aih.

[Music]

Border death report

Guest: Raul Ruiz

JD: Jakelin Caal Maquin was just 7-years-old when she died in the custody of U.S. Customs and Border Protection in December. She had traveled more than 3000 kilometres from Guatemala with her father. An autopsy on Friday established Jakelin's cause of death. And now doctors are saying that Border Protection workers should have seen signs that she was gravely ill. One of those doctors is Raul Ruiz. He is also a Democratic Congressman representing the 36th District of California. We reached Congressman Ruiz in Washington D.C.

CO: Congressman Ruiz what does the autopsy report reveal about how this little girl died?

RAUL RUIZ: The autopsy reveals that she died from a very severe sepsis caused by streptococcal bacteria that led to multi organ failure which eventually led to her demise through a cardiac arrest -- that was unsuccessfully resuscitated in the emergency department.

CO: And what kind of care did she receive when these symptoms first presented themselves?

RR: Well that's the question, right. The question is when did she have these symptoms and why was it that the CBP was not able to identify certain symptoms. The problem is that there was no clear guidance or guidelines, no meaningful health screening or evaluation that was done upon her arrival. It is very unlikely that Jakelin looked normal eight hours before she went into a coma, had seizures, and had respiratory failure. It's very rare that an infection can take a person who looks normal and then eight hours later died.

CO: When you mentioned CBP -- that's Customs and Border Patrol of the United States. In their statement they say that Border Patrol agents did everything in their power to provide emergency medical assistance to Jakelin immediately after her father notified agents of her distress. So what do we know as to when the father brought this to them -- and was it his responsibility to have told them earlier?

RR: Look I'm an emergency medicine physician. I'm also trained in humanitarian disaster aid and I practice emergency care humanitarian aid in emergency departments. And I can tell you that they are mincing words, they are misleading because there were no basic questionnaire or review of recent experience or signs and symptoms that could have led to them identifying that Jakelin was sick. There wasn't even any vital signs taken or any physical examination or any consultation with a care provider. If they would have done a vital sign, they would most likely found that she had a fever or a fast heart rate that was abnormal which then they could have consulted with a health care professional and immediately decided to transport that patient via helicopter to an emergency department and provided treatment right away which could have saved her life.

CO: What conditions did you see when you visited the border patrol facility where Jakelin was detained? What did you see? What was it like?

RR: I saw conditions that were subhuman and that lack the basic respect for human dignity. I saw many infants, toddlers, women, and elderly crammed packed into a cold windowless concrete room. They were so packed that you couldn't see the floors. We had infants without diapers soiling themselves. You had elderly coughing. Children coughing in that room. There were open toilets without privacy. People did not have the capacity to freely move, to go to a sink where there were soap so they can wash their hands. They lacked basic food like baby formula or baby food or any age appropriate food for the elderly. So there was a very substandard condition. And that's why I'm working to introduce legislation that will create a set of humanitarian standards that CBP would be legally required to abide by -- like health care where we will develop a way to do a review of recent history signs and symptoms to identify high risk individuals, prioritize them, and then have a system where they can back that up with a professional who can then determine whether they need specific treatment protocol while in custody or they need to be evacuated immediately.

CO: We heard from President Trump on Friday who said that Jakelin died because her father didn't give her water for a long time.

RR: That is a flat out scapegoating political lie -- trying to point the finger at somebody else, not taking responsibility as the leader of our country, and he should own up, be the President of the United States, take responsibility and come up with some solutions instead of playing the blame game.

CO: We should point out that there are two children who have died in custody in this way. And do you know what's become of Jakelin's family? They had an asylum claim. They were very concerned about staying in Guatemala. They wouldn't have traveled such a long distance.

RR: Yeah I don't know where they are in their legal claim. But many of the root causes for a family to take the risk to leave their country and come to the United States is because of the conditions in which they live in the their home country. They live impoverished -- without much of the rule of law, with a lot of organized crime threatening their children, threatening their families, if they don't sell drugs, if they don't take drugs. And so, many parents decide that the alternative risks are better than their current risks because in the long run they will live in a more safe-secure area where they can give their children a peace of mind, security, safety, and a better life.

CO: All right we will continue to follow this story. Congressman Ruiz I appreciate speaking with you today. Thank you.

RR: Thank you.

JD: Raul Ruiz is a Democratic Congressman representing the 36th District of California, and also an emergency physician. We reached Congressman Ruiz in Washington D.C. For more on this story visit our website: cbc.ca/aih.

[Music]

Puppy yoga

Guest: Krystie-Anne Haufler

JD: Puppy yoga...well it's pretty much what you would expect it to be: people doing yoga while puppies scamper about the room. And when I say that phrase "puppy yoga" -- I am going to go out on a limb and guess it conjures up notions of cuteness and furiness and relaxation. That however is not how it worked out for Krystie-Anne Haufler. She bought tickets to a puppy yoga session in Toronto. And she says she ended up getting booted from the group for having a quote, "bad vibe." We reached Krystie-Anne Haufler in Toronto.

CO: Kyrstie-Anne first of all why did you want to go out for puppy yoga?

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: I had seen it trending on Instagram, and you know I love yoga and I love animals so I thought it would be a very cool-fun experience.

CO: What did you know about what happens at puppy yoga?

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: I just figured it would be a little bit of mixture of playing with the puppies, taking pictures, and just kind of doing a little bit of yoga.

CO: So you bought some tickets for you and your mom.

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: Yeah I bought them as a birthday gift for my mom. So I had gotten there and I asked to purchase some mats and she said that I could only purchase them through an app. So my mom and I both tried to download the app and it wasn't working for us. And I offered to just give him money to rent the mats and he said no -- he couldn't do it and he wasn't very helpful. So then we went on into the class and by that time the class had been pretty full, and there wasn't much space for us inside.

CO: Did you get some mats?

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: No we didn't have mats. So went in without mats, and then there wasn't much space. And it was about 10 minutes into the class. And I apologized to my mom and I said you know we already started this off on a bad note -- like I'll ask for a refund and let's go to a class that isn't as busy in the future. So I had gotten up and I said I'm very sorry you know I wish I'd known that we could only use an app to rent the mats, but is it possible if I could get a refund and go to a future event? And he seemed quite annoyed but he was like yeah no problem I'll do it. And he was kind of snarky about it. And he was like there you go it's refunded. And I was like okay thank you, I really appreciate it, have a good day. As my mom and I were walking to the car, I received an email saying that you've been banned from all future Hive events.

CO: The Hive is a company that holds this puppy yoga session.

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: Yes.

CO: And you got -- immediately -- you got a message that you were banned from all the Hive activities?

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: Yes I did. I was in a bit of a shock. I didn't understand what I had done wrong. So I went on to message them. I sent an email, and they didn't respond. So I sent an Instagram (message) and he quote unquote -- this is exactly what he said to me on Instagram -- "We ban people based off of bad vibes. You had a bad vibe. So you got banned." And then he blocked me from Instagram.

CO: What do you think that means that you have a "bad vibe?"

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: I tried to wrap my head around it, and the only conclusion that I can come up to is you know it is this young guy, he started a business, he thinks he has a really cool niche, and I just think maybe the success has gotten to his head.

CO: But I mean to have a bad vibe -- that's quite the wrap. I don't know you, but you don't sound like somebody who could have a bad vibe.

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: No. And you know what, I felt bad because I never ask for like refunds. I'm totally not the person to be like, 'oh that's not what I ordered.' And it was big for me to be like, can I get a refund and go another time? And that's why, I was totally taken off guard when I got banned and then blocked.

CO: Now you've probably learned you're not the only person. Because the Toronto Star did a bit of research, went on Better Business Bureau complaint files and found that there were others who had similar experiences with the Hive. But apparently it does say on their website or their policy is that you can be banned if you are too negative.

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: Yeah but I find it strange because I wasn't rude at all. It wasn't until he sent me like a couple nasty emails back, that I said that I was going to be reporting him. That's probably the rudest thing that I did.

CO: Now when the Toronto Star asked the Hive about the complaints -- this is what they wrote back, this is a quote, "Nine girls have cried from happiness in our classes. One girl said the class saved her life. The Hive is a utopia. And 99.994 percent of people that have attended have not been banned, but my generation is all about outrage culture so you do you.".

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: Wow.

CO: Do you think that there are that many people who are happy with what's going on in puppy yoga?

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: I mean I could see it being very hard to be upset when there's a puppy in your arm. But I had it posted only for a couple hours on an open group and I had over 20 people relate to me. So I don't know. I mean I'm sure if I went through with the class and he wasn't the person who signed us in, it might have been a different experience. But I just think the policy behind the business -- it's not right.

CO: The website says: the Hive is based off of bees. There will be a colony in each city and you will have to come out to three of our events before you are eligible. And it says there will be a probationary period. And here is a quote, "Only people with good positive and loving vibes will be invited to join the colony."

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: I mean to me it sounds a bit cult-ey -- like only the people that he likes will be invited back.

CO: So what are your plans? Do you think that you'll try puppy yoga again?

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: Actually there's a place called Puppy Love Yoga -- and they emailed me and reached out and said, we'd love for you to experience a good puppy yoga experience. So they offered me two free tickets, so I am going to try it out. Give it another shot. But I definitely would never go back to the Hive.

CO: Well I'm getting a very good vibe from you Krystie-Anne. So thank you.

KRYSTIE-ANNE HAUFLER: Thank you so much Carol. I appreciate it.

JD: Krystie-Anne Haufler got booted out of a puppy yoga group for having a quote, "bad vibe." We reached Ms. Haufler in Toronto. And you can find more on this story on our website -- along with other stuff -- cbc.ca/aih. And we did reach out and request a response from The Hive but we did not hear back before we went to air.

[Music]

Patagonia

JD: The world of high finance is dangerous and hostile. Yes technically you sit at a desk and meet in boardrooms. But in your heart, you are out there on the wild frontier of investment. So it only makes sense that you wear something that reflects your ruggedness -- your courage. Something that keeps you from shivering in your air conditioned office. Something like a Patagonia vest. Not sure who started the trend, but a lot of high-powered business dudes wear those vests. There's a photo of Jeff Bezos in one -- looking like he's about to build a lean-to with branches, when he's likely just on his way to grab a kale smoothie. And the Instagram account "Midtown Uniform" is nothing but photos of guys strolling through New York's financial district inexplicably dressed for a back country kayak trip. It's a big business for the outdoor retailer Patagonia. Except that the company is not really into big business. And now it's politely making that clear. Recently the CEO of an agency called "Vested" -- yes I know but it is truly just a coincidence -- placed a corporate order for vests with Patagonia. An order Patagonia cordiale declined. A company rep emailed quote, "The brand is really focused right now on only co-branding with a small collection of like-minded and brand aligned areas; outdoor sports that are relevant to the gear we design, regenerative organic farming, and environmental activism." So Patagonia's being upfront that it no longer wants the money people's money. Because honesty is the vest policy.

[Music]

Part 2: Ontario grand chief questions $1.28M payout for consultant on Cat Lake housing conditions report

Algeria president out

Guest: Farah Souames

JD: Young Algerians have only ever known one president: Abdelaziz Bouteflika. And it was presumably a young Algerian who came up with the gleeful hashtag that is trending on Twitter today, #Bouteflexit. Yesterday, after two decades in power -- the 82-year-old leader stepped down following weeks of mass protests in Algeria. It was a pretty stunning development for a president who said just one month ago that he was planning on running again in the next election. But, unexpected as the abdication was -- protesters are already planning a massive demonstration this Friday to prevent members of President Bouteflika's so-called "clan" -- or members of the old guard from taking his place. Farah Souames has been participating in the street protests in recent weeks. She is also a writer and a filmmaker. We reached her in Algiers.

CO: Farah you were just a teenager when Abdelaziz Bouteflika first became president of Algeria. What was it like to wake up this morning with him gone?

FARAH SOUAMES: It is so weird, trust me. I called my father and I said you know I had to pinch myself so many times. I'm 36 and you know he came to power when I was 16. It's just weird.

CO: You took part in the demonstrations -- the protests -- and this is unusual for Algiers to be involved in that because we've seen so many other places that were part of Arab Spring what was it like for you to take part in those protests?

FS: It was an incredible experience. I worked as a full-time reporter in Egypt after the Arab Spring started and I've been to hundreds of demonstrations. But I was never lucky enough to have this atmosphere back home. And if you go back a little bit in history -- in Algeria a decree was signed in 2001 that was basically banning demonstrations because Algeria was driven out of a civil war. So for safety reasons they banned protesting inside in Algiers. So I took part in this civil movement from day one. And the first time I went to a protest on February 22nd -- it was the very first time in my life to protest in my own country. So I was a little bit you know confused -- I didn't know what's going to happen. You know we lost the taste of being in a public space in Algeria. Being in the streets with our countrymen and women. And when I arrived, I told my cab driver 'listen, if there is a lot of police I'm going to get back home. I'm a bit scared.' But when I arrived I was pleasantly surprised to see [inaudible] It was full of people. It was incredible to watch. I mean I will never forget the February 22nd -- never.

CO: But at the same time you were watching the president insisting that even though we haven't seen him in so long since he's had this stroke and yet he said he was determined first of all to take a fifth term as president, and even after he agreed to not do that he still wasn't going away. So what is it do you think that finally pushed him to make the decision that it is time to go?

FS: Well I think you know there are a lot of analysis. People said that the army forced his hand. And there are people who said he hasn't really the choice -- he's been rejected by the people for a couple of weeks in a row. And it's not only him -- this is what we do understand. People took it to the streets -- they didn't say only Bouteflika. They said we want them all gone. Him, his cabinet, his administration, and everybody surrounding the system. He is just the tip of the iceberg. Him resigning is not really a victory, it's just a first step.

CO: But the people on the inside -- around Bouteflika -- are very powerful. Do you have other allies on the inside? Are there those who will bring this change that you're hungering for beyond just the removal of the president?

FS: This is a very interesting question. People who were defending his first term including his prime minister, people of his own party, they changed basically their speeches and they said now we are with the civil movement. I mean he was even betrayed by people around him -- all across these four last weeks. They wanted to join the good side of the story if you want. The problem now is the system has been built over 20 years and it really did one achievement which is erase any sort of opposition. And this is a main problem because now if he is removed people will say, yeah just go -- we will find someone else. But until now, we don't have an emerging figure that could lead. You know we have to be realistic as well. You know we are removing an entire system, but we need to have an alternative as well.

CO: Also as a country Algeria has had so much war, hasn't it? I mean you had a war of independence, and then a very brutal civil war for so many years. And there has been a recovery from that, and Bouteflika was supposed to be -- he was part of that recovery...

FS: Oh no. I don't believe in that. Algeria didn't have time to grieve and to heal from the civil war -- from the war of independence. He was supposed to be the persona -- the hero of the national reconciliation. What is this legacy? So just to tell you that it's a bit complex you know on the ground.

CO: Because you have seen what happened elsewhere with Arab Spring -- Hosni Mubarak ousted. These were big moments. But then later the authorities, the military, turned against the street. And so do you worry about that? I mean you're on this high, you're on this role of making change, do you worry that the army might crack down on the protests?

FS: This is the scariest scenario that goes through my mind. I have to be honest. But I also have hope. Before the civil movement started I was hopeless. I was angry. Frustrated. Whatever you can imagine. But now I'm still worried. I'm still angry. I'm still frustrated because people want accountability as well. But I am not hopeless because what I've seen in the Algerian streets for the last six weeks was extra ordinary. I've never seen something like that.

CO: And will you be at the protests on Friday?

FS: Of course. I've been in almost every protest since February 22nd. I'm not going to miss that one. So I think it's going to be -- not maybe a turning point -- but I want to be with my people in the streets asking for our rights.

CO: Farah we will be watching. And I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

FS: Thank you.

JD: Farah Souames is a writer and filmmaker in Algeria's capital of Algiers. And that is where we reached her.

[Music]

What is right & wrong

JD: In Ottawa this afternoon there were two very different visions of what is right and what is wrong in Canadian politics. The first came from the Prime Minister -- fresh from booting Jane Philpott and Jody Wilson-Raybould from the Liberal caucus. Mr. Trudeau was speaking at an event in the House for young female leaders. As the prime minister spoke, several of the women turned their backs in protest. Mr. Trudeau did not shy away from speaking about his decision -- which he says was sparked by Ms. Wilson-Raybould's refusal to compromise on the prosecution of SNC-Lavalin.

SOUNDCLIP

PRIME MINISTER JUSTIN TRUDEAU: Doing good things is always going to be hard. You know my second favourite Prime Minister -- Wilfrid Laurier -- made a good point at one point around compromise. And he said you know if we all stay in our solitudes, if we all stay in our firm position that we are right and nobody else is right, then there is no movement. And it's actually easy to cross your arms, and stand in a place and say, I'm not budging from my position because I'm right. What is actually more difficult is to look for thoughtful compromise, is to look for a way to move forward as people who have very different perspectives sometimes on very important issues.

JD: The next view on what is right and or wrong in Canadian politics came when reporters asked Jane Philpott and Jody Wilson-Raybould how they felt about being kicked out of caucus. Here is Ms. Wilson-Raybould's reply.

SOUNDCLIP

JODY WILSON-RAYBOULD: I came here to be a Member of Parliament -- I still am a Member of Parliament, a proud one, of Vancouver Granville -- to represent Canadians, to bring forward issues that are really important to me, issues I think all of us share: issues around climate change, issues around the criminal justice system, around Indigenous reconciliation, and most importantly around doing politics differently and ensuring that every person's voice counts. So I am -- to put it lightly -- disappointed. And I would say that if you stand up for what you believe is right and you hold strong to your principles, the truth and principles must always come first. And that's what I did and that's what I'll continue to do.

REPORTER: The Prime Minister seemed to make the firing offense -- in his speech he referred explicitly to a lack of trust. He called it unconscionable to record the Clerk of the Privy Council. And that seemed to be among many of your colleagues as well -- what they consider the straw that broke the camel's back. How do you respond to that?

JODY WILSON-RAYBOULD: Well first of all, trust is a two-way street. And talking about unconscionable, I think it is unconscionable to tread over the independence of the prosecutor. It is unconscionable not to uphold the rule of law. And I have always maintained that stance. I think it is very alarming that people are focusing on the actual recording of a tape as opposed to the contents of the tape. The contents of the tape in my view and the view of many people that I've reached out speak for itself. I recorded that tape. There's nothing illegal about it. And I said in any other circumstance, it would be inappropriate. I was protecting myself. I knew that something very dangerous and wrong was going to happen, and that my job was at risk.

REPORTER: To you Ms. Philpott. You went to bat for something which wasn't your file. So how do you explain going to bat for that when other people didn't?

JANE PHILPOTT: I don't see it as going to bat necessarily. What happened was that after this story became known in the public and it was clear that there had been attempts to persuade the former Attorney General to intervene in a criminal trial and the communications of the government were to deny that that took place -- I could not come out here in good conscience and deny it because I believed what the former attorney general said. And there comes a point as a cabinet minister, you don't necessarily agree with every single decision that's made but you have to around that table say you know we've discussed this -- I'm on-board, I can go out there and defend the government's position.

REPORTER: What about all of your colleagues who said it could...

JANE PHILPOTT: You'd have to ask them.

JD: That was Jane Philipott (and) before that, Jody Wilson-Raybould speaking to reporters in Ottawa.

[Music]

Cat Lake consultant

Guest: Alvin Fiddler

JD: Gerald Paulin says he delivered as promised. Now he deserves to get paid. Mr. Paulin is a Thunder Bay based consultant. The Cat Lake First Nation hired him to secure federal funding to address their northwestern Ontario community's desperate housing needs. Instead of receiving an hourly rate for his work, Mr. Paulin agreed to take the equivalent of 10 percent of whatever new government money he managed to bring in. If no new money had come in, he would have gotten nothing. But a new report found mould in almost every house on the reserve, and the federal government promised 12.8-million dollars to replace dozens of homes in the community. So 10 percent of 12.8-million of course is 1.28-million. That seems a bit steep to Alvin Fiddler. Mr. Fiddler is the Grand Chief of the Nishnawbe Aski Nation. We reached Chief Fiddler in Thunder Bay.

CO: Grand Chief Fiddler why shouldn't this consultant get the 1.28-million dollars he says he's owed?

ALVIN FIDDLER: There is too many questions around the contract that he signed with the community. And just looking at the housing needs in Cat Lake -- I think their goal was that whatever amount they were able to negotiate with the federal government that most of that money would go directly to them -- either to build new homes or to renovate existing homes.

CO: But the community is saying that they'll pay him but not out of the money that came from the federal government -- they'll take it from someplace else. And they signed a contract with him to this effect.

AF: Well I think like any contract you know either party has a right to terminate a contract at any time. And I would hope that in this case that's something that the committee would consider because under the current terms of the contract for a consultant to take away a significant amount of money from a community that's in dire need of housing is simply wrong.

CO: Do you think that Cat Lake First Nation would have got 12.8-million dollars that the feds finally gave it -- do you think that they got that money without the efforts of this consultant Gerald Paulin?

AF: Well I don't really know what he did in terms of getting the word out on what was happening in the community -- it was MP Charlie Angus, and the MPP for this area Sol Mamakwa that really made that push -- putting Kiiwetinoong on the map and just drawing the attention to [inaudible] in Canada.

CO: How many communities -- First Nation communities -- have housing in the condition that are in Cat Lake?

AF: Well Nishnawbe Aski Nation represents 49 communities in northwest or northeast Ontario. You can go to any community in that territory-- and that's what we hear all the time from the leadership in terms of the number one need or the number one priority is housing.

CO: So this report that Gerald Paulin -- this hired consultant -- prepared he said that there were safety issues, there was mould in every room of every house, there was bad electrical work, improperly installed woodstoves. And that report prompted outrage. There were politicians who contributed to the awareness. There were national news stories that came out. And the community got 12.8-million dollars in order to fix those things. Why don't other communities get that? Is that what it takes? Is that what you have to do to get that kind of publicity to get that kind of news in order to get the funding you need for your community?

AF: Well in this case for this community that's what they had to do. The leadership you know I know they travel to Toronto, they travel to Ottawa -- at Queen's Park they held a press conference there. It shouldn't have to come to that I think for any community to have their housing needs addressed. I think that's why we need to revisit the whole [inaudible] process under sort of the existing policies that the Indian Affairs currently has.

CO: So this consultant he says that he took on the work -- he said he would work for free unless he got money. He would take 10 percent from whatever he was able to get from the government. He apparently lived in one of the mouldy homes. He says he's got health problems as a result. And he says he is owed this money.

AF: So yeah we don't know that though in terms of how healthy he was before he moved into one of these homes. You know it's just his word that we're supposed to accept. You know my position is that people like that -- I think you know we owe it to the communities especially communities like Cat Lake that are in a very vulnerable place to protect them from consultants like Mr. Pauline and fortunately it's not unique. We know of other consultants and contractors and other service providers out there that take advantage of these vulnerable communities.

CO: But wait a second Cat Lake First Nation has hired this man to do more work in that --and other First Nations are asking about his services. So what does that tell you?

AF: Yeah I'm not sure about that. I know they sent a notice to him a few weeks ago terminating the contract, so I can't say for sure if that contract is still valid or not.

CO: Apparently according to The Globe and Mail which has been doing good reporting on this -- they said that the Cat Lake band council had terminated his contract the day before the federal money was -- the interim housing agreement -- was issued. But since then they have agreed to pay him in full from a different revenue stream.

AF: Yeah I don't quite understand that either. I haven't talked to the Chief about it directly. You know that was my understanding like everybody else right before that agreement was signed with Minister O'Regan that they had terminated the contract with Mr. Paulin.

CO: So who do you blame here? Is it the consultant who helped bring this money in or is it the system that doesn't work until someone like that gets involved?

AF: Yeah I think we just need to look at sort of the big picture. You know I think we need to do more to protect communities like Cat Lake you know that are in a very vulnerable position from people like Mr. Paulin that you know all they see is money signs or dollar signs and are not really looking at what the needs are in the communities. So I think you know there has to be some process developed to you know put up a red flag on situations like this. And like I said unfortunately it's not just this one consultant. I mean we've heard this story too many times.

CO: Appreciate speaking with you Grand Chief Fiddler. Thank you.

AF: Thank you.

JD: Alvin Fiddler is the Grand Chief of the Nishnawbe Aski Nation. We reached him in Thunder Bay, Ontario. We have more on this story on our website: cbc.ca/aih.

[Music]

Joe Biden

JD: It was far from an apology. But Joe Biden has promised to be more careful about violating women's personal space. In recent days, the former U.S. Vice President has faced allegations from four women about his past behaviour. One woman said he kissed her on the back of the head, another that he rested his hand on her thigh even after she made it obvious that she was uncomfortable. So today, Mr. Biden who is widely expected to be mulling a run for president tried to explain his actions in a video posted to Twitter. Here's part of what he had to say.

SOUNDCLIP

JOE BIDEN: In my career I always tried to make a human connection. That's my responsibility. I shake hands. I hug people. I grab men and women by the shoulders and say, 'you can do this.' And whether they are women, men, young, old -- it is the way I've always been. It is the way I've tried to show I care about them, and I am listening. Over the years knowing what I've been through -- the things that I've faced -- I found that scores, if not hundreds of people, come up to me and reached out for solace and comfort; something -- anything -- that may help them get through the tragedy they're going through. And so it is just who I am. You know social norms have begun to change, they have shifted -- and the boundaries of protecting personal space have been reset. And I get it. And I'll be much more mindful. That's my responsibility. My responsibility and I'll meet it. But I always believe governing quite frankly -- life for that matter -- is about connecting -- (it is about) connecting with people. That won't change. But I will be more mindful and respectful of people's personal space. And that's a good thing. That's a good thing.

JD: That was former U.S. Vice President Joe Biden in a video posted to Twitter today addressing accusations from a number of women who say his past behaviour made them uncomfortable.

[Music]

Part 3: Remembering Joan Jones

Affordable Ottawa housing

Guest: Daniel Tucker Simmons

JD: This week, in what could be a very important test case for the housing industry --residents of a neighbourhood in Ottawa filed a human rights complaint citing "hyper-gentrification." Former tenants of Heron Gate Village claimed that their landlord forced them out of their largely immigrant communities last year, to pave the way for higher-end housing that would attract white, non-immigrant, residents. Further they claim the City of Ottawa is complicit in this discrimination. The claim seeks 50-thousand dollars in damages for each of the 14 claimants, and that the developers build new rental units to be put on the market for the same cost. Daniel Tucker Simmons is the lawyer representing the claimants. He helped them file their human rights complaint. We reached Mr. Tucker Simmons in Ottawa.

CO: Mr. Tucker Simmons what did it mean for your clients -- those people living in Heron Gate Village in Ottawa -- what did it mean to them when they were told that they had to go -- had to move?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: It meant the loss of their community. It meant the loss of all of the relationships that they've built up over the years. And even beyond, those relationships they are actually the concrete social-economic and cultural benefits that they lost as a result of being evicted from that community.

CO: And how much notice did they get?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: Well they were given notice in May, and the eviction date was end of September so I guess that's about four months or so.

CO: And what kind of a community was it? What did they have? What had they established? Who was living there?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: It was a very special community -- typical of newcomers to Canada where they cluster in one area and develop a very tight-knit social relationship. And they become quite close with their neighbours, they help each other by watching each other's kids. Some of the members that had been there for a longer period will introduce newcomers to you know the banking system, help them open bank accounts, help them navigate the grocery store, translate documents. It was really a supportive community. They've even formed various of kinds of cultural and social institutions. Somali Centre for Family Services nearby. They established a mosque. And a whole slew of a kind of informal businesses that cater to their communities individual needs.

CO: What have you told the Human Rights Tribunal as to what you think and your clients think was the reason for the eviction by the company -- development company -- Timbercreek?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: In this case the pursuit of profit -- you know business as usual has a discriminatory effect. It's a situation where a developer has gone into a racialized neighbourhood, evicted all the tenants, and is proposing to build or developed the real estate in such a way as to change -- radically change -- the demographic composition of the neighbourhood so that it will become a non-immigrant, predominantly white community. It's that effect that we're challenging in what we call discrimination.

CO: And so what evidence do you have that that was what they were doing?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: It's important to distinguish between -- to be very precise about what kind of discrimination this is. We're not saying that developers search out communities -- racialized communities specifically -- in order to engage in some kind of apartheid demographic engineering. It's the normal operation of this industry that disproportionately targets people of colour. And we know that because of the social science data that's available -- we can show statistically that this predatory form of real estate development keeps happening in immigrant communities. And if we can show that it really begs the question, well are we saying that's a coincidence or are we going to tolerate racialized communities constantly being selected for this kind of development? And that's what's discriminatory.

CO: What reasons did they give for the eviction?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: They wanted to redevelop the property. And they've been quite clear for many years that their intention is to build luxury, higher-end, accommodation. And beyond that is to align this neighbourhood -- Heron Gate with a neighbourhood on its northern border called Alta Vista. According to Stats Can for example the Heron Gate community is about 70 percent people of colour. Whereas Alta Vista -- the community just to its north -- is 80 percent white. So if you're going to build an alignment -- if you're going to build accommodation that essentially supplements the kind of accommodation that's available in Alta Vista, then you're going to be attracting those residents. And I think that's their explicit intention is to attract homeowners in Alta Vista.

CO: And why do you think the City of Ottawa is complicit in this?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: The City of Ottawa was complicity -- it comes from the fact that it was aware that this is a problem area. It knew that the landlord -- over many years it knew -- that the landlord was not maintaining the property to standard. It knows that because by-law enforcement has a property standards branch that conducts inspections. Yet not only didn't take any action but also was complicit in the landlord's development proposals and didn't take any regulatory measures to prevent the further erosion of this community and to prevent the evictions and demolition.

CO: Doesn't the plan that Timbercreek -- the company -- have include about 20 percent of the units will be built for affordable housing?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: That's one very modest step in the right direction. Just recall that prior to the demolitions 100 percent of the units were affordable. So we're talking about a significant loss. Now their plan is to increase the density of the area to build more units than there were previously. But you're still talking about a very small percentage of the overall. And then we also don't have details on precisely what they mean by affordable,right.

CO: What applications do you think this has if you are successful for other communities and other developers?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: It does have very profound consequences. I think Timbercreek recognizes that and I think probably the industry will recognize that as this case works its way through the human rights tribunal process. The tribunal's ruling could effectively put an end to this predatory form of development in Ontario where developers move into a racialized community, evict everybody, and then build something that people of colour or immigrants cannot afford. Other provinces in Canada have very similar legislation. I would expect them to follow the example of the Human Rights Tribunal if we get a positive ruling.

CO: Just finally, did the people in this community -- did they find other housing? Have they been able to form a community once again someplace else in Ottawa?

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: Not really. They have found other housing, but it was very difficult. They were all evicted over a very concentrated period of time. So it's a very very competitive housing market. And it was just not possible to regroup anywhere. Some families were able to relocate in Heron Gate and that's great -- but many were not.

CO: All right Mr. Tucker Simmons we'll leave it there. I appreciate speaking with you. Thank you.

DANIEL TUCKER SIMMONS: Thank you.

JD: That was Daniel Tucker Simmons, the lawyer for former residents of Heron Gate Village. We reached him in Ottawa.

[Music]

Joan Jones obit

Guest: Augy Jones

JD: Joan Jones may not have been the most famous name in the fight for black civil rights in Nova Scotia. That honour likely would go to her former husband, Rocky Jones. But behind the scenes she definitely was one of the most important figures in black community activism on the East Coast. She helped found The Nova Scotia Project -- that is an organization tackling racial discrimination. The interracial club Kwacha House. And Halifax Black History Month, to name just a few of her accomplishments. Joan Jones died on Monday. She was 79-years-old. In 1990, Ms. Jones gave commentary to CBC Radio on the one-year anniversary of the Cole Harbour High brawls -- when a series of fights between black and white students put the Halifax-area school on the national stage or in the national spotlight. Here is part of what Ms. Jones said.

SOUNDCLIP

JOAN JONES: It started as just a snowball fight in a school parking lot. But all the students on one side were white. Other students on the other, black. Eventually, eight whites and ten blacks were charged in connection with the violence. A year later, blacks remembered the confrontation at Cole Harbour High School as one of the most important events of the decade. Since Cole Harbour it has been impossible for anyone to deny what blacks have known for 200 years. Racism is as Nova Scotian as Blueberry Grunt. Historically, Nova Scotian-blacks have lived in isolation. They have been forced to accept inferior education, and have been shut out of good jobs. Usually when we complain the answer is, 'but look how far you've come.' This answer no longer holds water. Cole Habour has been the catalyst for renewed activism in the entire black community. People who would not normally speak out or get involved, now demand to be heard.

JD: That was Nova Scotia civil rights activist Joan Jones speaking on CBC Radio in 1990. Her son, Augy Jones, is the manager of Student Experience at St. Francis Xavier University. We reached Augy Jones in Halifax.

CO: Augy first of all I'm sorry for the loss of your mom.

AUGY JONES: I appreciate that Carol. It's been sudden, and we're just taking care of some arrangements now. But it's nice that people are kind of getting a view of who mom was. And I think she was -- well I know she was overshadowed by you know dad. So it's great that she's getting some recognition.

CO: That is what I want to ask you about. Because your dad, Rocky Jones, was very well-known -- very much the public face, a public face, of the civil rights movement in Nova Scotia and in Canada. But your mom, we don't know. Was that by design that we don't know much about her?

AJ: Yeah definitely. And I think it's a testament to those people that liked to be behind the scenes and do not like the spotlight. And I think that we often judge especially nowadays when people are looking for likes and you know who's out in the front of certain movements. But my mom didn't like that. She was better -- she felt more comfortable being at the committee meetings and organizing things and putting in policies and getting people together. And then when the cameras showed up or the microphone was turned on, she wasn't really interested in any of that spotlight.

CO: Well since we never did get to know her very well -- what was she like?

AJ: Well I think first, she was a fantastic mother. I think she's an award winning cook. So that would be first. And I would say to two, she brought up a family with you know high standards and very disciplined. You know she taught me things that would probably be considered you know women's work at the time -- in the 70s -- but you know I had to cook, clean, do the laundry, you know clean rooms. She basically said you know I'm out here hustling, bringing money home, just like you dad is -- and so when I get home, I'd like the place clean. And I'm really blessed with that now because you know I'm 50 years old, my house is spotless.

CO: And there were five of your kids, right?

AJ: There was.

CO: Oh that's a houseful. But at the same time that she was raising you and doing so much of the background work for the civil rights movements especially in Nova Scotia -- there were a lot of frightening moments for her I think. I mean a lot of threats. What was going on that I guess you must have been trying to protect you from?

AJ: Well I think at the time obviously I think there were people in Nova Scotia who didn't believe in equity and so there were death threats. There was a time where you know we lived in a boarding house -- we owned a boarding house at one time -- and somebody set fire to the house in the back. But yet I will say that 90 percent of the time from my perspective as a kid, it was about playing and eating and having fun. And so she really protected us from any of those -- even being aware of any of those threats.

CO: Now your mom's legendary cooking attracted lots of people to your house including some rather famous ones. Tell us what supper was like sometimes.

AJ: It was great conversation, and I mean with a mix of people. There were black people there, there were white people there, there were men, there were women. It was just a real place of socializing and sharing ideas. And the one thing was that you had to be open-minded to equity. So we had one night where Harry Belafonte was at the house. Miriam Makeba. Stokely Carmichael. That was a regular thing -- if you came to Halifax, you had to stop by Joan and Rocky's for dinner.

CO: Okay but your mom was fiercely defensive of you and protective. And I want you to tell us the story about one particular visitor -- a heavyweight boxer.

AJ: Yes. Trevor Berbick -- at the time he was on the rankings of a world champ, and he had his car and he came pealing into the backyard one time. And my mom comes running out the back door and as Trevor is getting out of his car -- the heavyweight champ -- my mom grabbed him and slams him against the car and goes, 'Don't you ever come in that driveway at that speed again.' Because we played at the end of the driveway, and if he was going fast he might not have saw us. And that really epitomizes my mom. She was not afraid of anybody, and fiercely defended not only her children but she fiercely defended equality and fairness.

CO: And where did that come from? What in her own life or her upbringing brought her to the point where she was such a strong and powerful -- though quiet in the background -- advocate for civil rights?

AJ: So when she moved from Toronto I think that she was impressed and influenced by the civil rights movement in the States and so was my dad. So when they came back to Halifax and '65 there were a lot of things going on that needed responding to. And I think as a couple, they decided to do that. And that led to you know the transition year program at Dalhousie -- the Black United Front. That was one of the first government organizations in Nova Scotia that was looking out for the welfare of African-Nova Scotians. That's Joan and Rocky. And the history books would put Rocky in the front of it, but I would say that Joan was equally involved in all of those initiatives. But then when the camera came on she just didn't want to be in front of the camera.

CO: Well aside from being a first rate mom and raising five kids who know how to cook and clean -- what do you think her legacy is?

AJ: I see her legacy as activism does not always look -- it's not fancy, it's not bells and whistles. You can be an activist and be someone that pushes for change by going to a committee -- being involved in like she was on the board for the local children's hospital. She was involved with the AIDS coalition. She was involved with single mothers who were caught up in the family court system. So my mother had been doing behind the scenes work since 1960. And yet she was very effective and very instrumental in some of the things that exist in Nova Scotia now. So I see her as a change maker. But really speaking from the perspective of the change makers that you never hear about.

CO: Augy thank you so much for telling us about your mom, and bringing her out of the shadows and putting her on the front stage. She's totally worthy of that. Thank you.

AJ: It's great to talk to you Carol.

JD: Augy Jones is the son of Nova Scotia black civil rights activist Joan Jones. Ms. Jones died Monday. She was 79-years-old. We reached Augy Jones in Halifax.

[Music]

Premier Brian Pallister

JD: Make it three provinces that are now taking the federal government to court over its carbon tax. Manitoba's Premier Brian Pallister took a leaf out of Saskatchewan and Ontario's books today in announcing a legal challenge against the feds by that province. Premier Pallister says Manitoba had a carbon pricing plan but Ottawa rejected it. And meanwhile he says the province is getting no credit for the green investments it's already made in hydroelectricity. He says all of this left the province no choice but to head to court. Here is part of what Premier Pallister said to reporters today.

SOUNDCLIP

BRIAN PALLISTER: Ottawa cannot impose a carbon tax on a province that has a credible greenhouse gas reduction plan of its own -- and we do. The federal plan as it has been presented by the federal government is not a national plan. It's a patchwork quilt of ad hoc deals that create different standards in every province. You know this has been a long and difficult process of negotiation. And we've tried our very best to present the argument that we should be allowed to have our own plan here in Manitoba -- we don't need the federal plan. We tried to keep Justin Trudeau out of the pockets of Manitobans. I mean we worked awfully, awfully, hard and took great political risk in presenting a plan which introduced a carbon levy -- flat and a low -- but nonetheless a carbon levy. We felt this was the right approach to take and we did our best at political risk to do that. That wasn't respected by the federal government. They said no, their way or the highway. And so this is what has brought us sadly to this point. But I know unfairness when I see it -- and I see this as unfair. I see it as disrespectful and I don't see it as helping our environment. And I don't see it as doing anything but hurting our economy. And so I'm going to stand up for Manitobans in this and say we need to challenge this.

JD: Manitoba Progressive Conservative Premier Brian Pallister speaking at a news conference today announcing a legal challenge against the federal government over its carbon tax.

[Music]

E.U. Brexit

Guest: Elmar Brok

JD: The European Union has a message for Britain: Get out! Now. Today, European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker dismissed the UK's request for another short extension to the Brexit withdrawal deadline. He said that unless the deadlocked UK Parliament can figure out a plan, it will likely crash out of the EU without a deal on April 12th. Meanwhile, Theresa May has met with Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn in a last-ditch attempt to figure out a way forward and out. Elmar Brok is a German European Parliament Member who is on the EU's Brexit steering group. We reached Mr. Brok in Brussels. And we do apologize in advance for the poor quality of the phoneline.

CO: Mr. Brok at this point does the United Kingdom have any cards left to play with the European Union?

ELMAR BROK: No. The negotiations are finished. The withdrawal agreement is agreed between the European Commission and the British government -- the only point is that the British government does not get a majority vote for that in the House of Commons.

CO: But the European Union is playing hardball, aren't they? I mean they're saying look you only have so many more days -- if you don't have a deal by April 12th, well that's too bad. So I mean why not give them more time? This is a huge decision for the United Kingdom and for Europe. Why not give them more breathing space?

EB: Look this agreement is ready since November. Since November they're trying to find a majority. And nothing changes. Look we have on the May of 26 elections of the European Parliament. The 12th of April -- it's the last day for the United Kingdom -- they can call for elections. They have to be out before the European elections. Otherwise the European elections become illegal. So they must be out before the 22nd of May the latest. If they do not want to take part in European elections.

CO: But you know that a no-deal Brexit would be would be difficult for Europe, not just for the UK. There's a lot of preparations, a lot of things will change, and a lot of consequences. So I mean shouldn't everyone at this point be trying to figure out some way -- some compromise -- that can avert a disaster here?

EB: The withdrawal agreement is agreed -- it is finalized. There's no negotiations -- any more [inaudible]. The problem is, there's no majority in the House of Commons. And we cannot help them. They find a solution now that has a majority for the deal that the government negotiated or they've asked for a long extension for a one two years -- and having that time general elections or a referendum.

CO: Are you at all encouraged by the fact that Theresa May and Jeremy Corbyn seem to be reaching out to each other to find some last minute way of making their own relationship work?

EB: They are happy about that, and hopefully in the next two-three days they come to a conclusion -- they should have done this two years ago or three weeks ago. We have all the time called for them to talk to each other. Rvery European continental --European country -- the opposition and the government has talked to each other. Now for the first time they seems so that they take country before party. Until now they took party before country. And hopefully the next two days they come up with a solution then it can be rectified.

CO: And people should know that there are two parts to this. There is the withdrawal agreement -- but there is this political declaration that's necessary, that's the part where there might be some compromise between Mr. Corbyn and Ms. May.

EB: We have said that. The declaration is easy to complete and change if that is helpful to come to a deal, but not [inaudible].

CO: So this would be what? There's a possibility of -- what -- a free trade agreement? A customs arrangement? A customs union? European economic area? I mean is that all on the table?

EB: That is all fine for us. We would be happy about such a solution if Britain wants to have it.

CO: How are people in Germany regarding this chaos -- this Brexit chaos?

EB: Look we have in Germany -- families every evening fight over what should we look on the TV -- should we look at a movie or the House of Commons -- it is like a soap opera. People started to be fed up. I think when Britain has called for leaving the European Union -- as for the article 15, it includes 2 years deadline which was completed on the 29th of March -- we gave them already [inaudible]. And if they want to go leave and they have no clue and no understanding of the majority -- how to leave then it is up to the Brits. We are totally united. 27 countries. The commission, the parliament, the council are totally united in this quest. This dysfunctional House of Commons which makes it not possible at the moment to ratify that.

CO: If they can figure all this out, what will Germans watch on TV?

EB: People start to laugh or become angry. Jump in as fast [inaudible] completely. We will not wait longer. The wrong decision is better than no decision because we want to continue our planning’s. I think it is an incredible story because of the dysfunctional House of Commons where until now nobody was able to try to have across party compromise.

CO: Mr. Brok we will be watching and I appreciate speaking with you tonight. Thank you.

EB: Thank you very much.

JD: Elmar Brok is a German European Parliament Member who is on the EU Brexit steering group. We Mr. Brok in Brussels.

[Music]

The Reiwa Era

JD: Literally it translates as, "peace through order." Or "good peace." But it definitely actually means "beautiful harmony." The last one is the final word from the Japanese government on the new imperial era. The "Reiwa" era -- the name of which was officially unveiled on Monday. In Japan, there is a new era every time there's a new emperor. And at the end of April, when Emperor Akihito abdicates the throne -- and his eldest son, Naruhito, takes over it will mark the beginning of the "Reiwa" era. The name comes from a poem about plum blossoms in the oldest existing anthology of Japanese poetry. And which the government has clarified means "beautiful harmony." And to celebrate this occasion everyone in Japan is going on vacation whether they want to or not. From April 27th to May 6th, parliament has decreed that the entire country will be on holiday. Which sounds relaxing, until you think about the ramifications. If you're a contract worker you won't get paid. If you're a parent your kids school and daycare will be closed. And if you haven't booked a flight somewhere by this point, you are out of luck. So this is not created a universal sense of "beautiful harmony" in Japan. In a poll by the newspaper Asahi Shimbun, 45 per cent of people said they felt unhappy about the mandatory 10-day holiday. Not exactly the most harmonious start to the Reiwa era. And kind of a drag for the government. Never the best when you give everyone a break and half the country responds, Aw! Gimme a break

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April 3, 2019 Episode Transcript

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