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Front Burner Transcript for June 30, 2025

Guest Host: Elaine Chau

ELAINE CHAU: Hi, I'm Elaine Chau, in for Jayme Poisson.

[Music: Theme]

EC: For more than a decade, Masai Ujiri guided the Toronto Raptors franchise, playing a huge part in its first NBA championship win in 2019. On Friday, the Raptors announced that after 13 seasons, Ujiri's time as president and vice chairman of the team was over. Keith Pelley, the president and CEO of Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment, or MLSE, which owns the Raptors, said that it was a tough decision, but one that he felt was right for the team's future.

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KEITH PELLEY: His legacy will be indelibly etched in our city in perpetuity based on him playing such a significant role in bringing the 2019 NBA Championship to our city, and also how he transformed our brand and worked through the Raptors to create a connection with so many fans in Toronto.

EC: There's been rumours in recent years of friction between Ujiri and Edward Rogers, who's about to finalize his majority share purchase of MLSE. Back in 2021, according to the Toronto Star, Rogers was opposed to Ujiri getting a $15-million-a-year contract.

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UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Edward Rogers actively fought plans to keep Masai Ujiri as head of the Toronto Raptors this summer -- saying he was not worth the amount offered -- and then tried to extract an extraordinary benefit for his own company...

EC: Masai Ujiri is one of the most recognizable and successful Canadian sports executives in recent history. He's known for getting the best out of every deal, charm his way through every room, and slowly build teams that could compete at the very highest level. Ujiri was raised in Northern Nigeria, had a modest playing career in Europe, and later worked as an unpaid scout with the Orlando Magic. In less than a decade, he became the general manager of the Denver Nuggets. Three years after that, he joined the Toronto Raptors as president and GM. Ujiri went on to build some of the most memorable teams in Canadian sports history, with that championship in 2019 as a real capstone moment.

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MASAI UJIRI: It's unbelievable for the players and the coaches and ownership. Alvin knows, you know, like these guys paved the way for us and kept growing, kept building. And here we find ourselves.

EC: But since then, Masai Ujiri's time in Toronto has been subject to some real difficulty. Shortly after that championship, the team he assembled began to go their separate ways. Kawhi Leonard left. Kyle Lowry left. Pascal Siakam was traded and so was OG Anunoby. The list goes on. And in came a rotating cast of players that many in the fanbase felt disconnected to. Jayme spoke to Masai Ujiri in 2021 about his career to that point, life after a history-making NBA title, his African roots and relationship to Canada, and his bid to internationalize the game of basketball. Here is that conversation.

[Music: Theme]

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JAYME POISSON: Hi, Masai. It is such a pleasure to have you here. Thank you so much for joining me.

MASAI UJIRI: Thank you for having me.

JP: And I'll say for our listeners, we are actually sitting in the middle of the OVO practice court, which is pretty cool.

MASAI UJIRI: Yeah, really cool.

JP: A few weeks ago you signed on to be both vice chairman and president of the Raptors and you said that you're here to stay. And I know a lot of people thought maybe you'd leave, maybe you'd head to a bigger market like New York. And what, what is keeping you here in Toronto?

MASAI UJIRI: Ah, big question. You started off with a big one, huh? Haha. No, um. Toronto has become home, you know, for me, for my family. There's something about this space of Toronto, of Canada, that really is special. It gives me a good platform to speak, to represent. Um, and it's a unique space.

JP: Why do you think that is? What makes it so unique?

MASAI UJIRI: There's a lot to do with, I think, the diversity of the country, the city, Toronto. I think different people from all walks of life, all parts of the world, different parts of the word. And there's a freeness. There's a certain way, you know, that a lot of people around the world don't even know. But, and sometimes we inside don't even know.

JP: You know, as someone who grew up in Toronto, whenever I hear you talk about the city, it makes me feel really guilty that I'm always complaining about the traffic. [laughter] But I, seriously, I saw you the other day. Um, you were introducing this art installation that you helped put together at Union Station. And you got a bit emotional when you started to talk about all the diverse faces that you see when you look up in the stands [MASAI: Mm-hmm.] during a Raptors game.

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MASAI UJIRI: And I come to the games every day. I see people [emotional] from everywhere.

JP: In your new role as vice chairman, what changes for you, if anything?

MASAI UJIRI: I think, first, on the emotion, you know, it's, to me, it's very important that people understand that we do have issues, you know, like here and everywhere in the world, and that's what resonates with me in some kind of way, that we have people from all over the world. And we all need to treat each other better. Yeah, when I look at Black people, I look at Indigenous people, I look at what's going on with Asians. We just need to be better.

JP: And do you think in your role now as president and vice chairman, you have more of an ability to speak to those issues, to address those issues?

MASAI UJIRI: I hope I do. It's not only -- you can't just speak alone. You have to act, right? You know, it's -- there's the platform and the voice. I also have to represent, and you represent by actions.

JP: You are good friends with Barack Obama. Paul Kagame is, I believe, one of your mentors as well. When you think about leadership, what are the most important qualities to you?

MASAI UJIRI: What I've learned from these people are, you know, they are incredible visionaries. Then, I think as a leader you have to have the ability to hire people that are smart, and in fact, smarter than you as a leader. And I think it's-- and I think these guys, um, these guys do it.

JP: What do you think your greatest strength is as a leader?

MASAI UJIRI: I have no idea. [laughs] I have no idea why they let me do this. [laughter] You know why? One of the things I was humbled by was, um, when I'm with these guys and they ask me questions, yeah, it baffles me because they know everything. So why would they ask a question. And I've had moments with President Kagame or 44 or Justin Trudeau, and they, you know, they are inquisitive in their minds too, you know, and very filled with information, so much information. It's really like, it's mind-boggling.

JP: I wonder if we can spend a bit of time talking about Kyle Lowry.

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NBA PLAY-BY-PLAY ANNOUNCER: Lowry's been hot.

[Swish]

NBA PLAY-BY-PLAY ANNOUNCER: That continues! Kyle Lowry.

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[Sounds of basketball game action]

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NBA BROADCAST HOST: How does a young guy from North Philadelphia, who had all kinds of questions about him -- not tall enough, not fast enough, not athl-- how does he become an NBA champion?

KYLE LOWRY: Hard work, never letting nobody tell you you can't do something special, and um, just a great group of guys. Yeah, I can't really think right now, this is crazy. This awesome, man. Toronto, Canada, we brought it home, baby! We brought it home!

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NBA BROADCAST HOST 2: You wonder if that is the final walk of the greatest Raptor of all time in Kyle Lowry.

MASAI UJIRI: Yes.

JP: So, uh, this, this team arguably said goodbye recently to its heart and soul. And he's someone who's always loved the challenge, I think, probably of being underestimated, and he walked away the greatest Raptor of all time. And I know you, you have also said that. And I wonder if you could reflect on what's different about the Kyle Lowry who came nine years ago and the Kyle Lowry who left.

MASAI UJIRI: He's nine years older. [laughter] Yeah, he's somebody that's really courageous, somebody that wants to be bigger, better. And that's what Kyle was. You know, like and, yeah, we had our ups and downs, and yeah, he had his moments, you know. But I've always said it, you know, like he's always been respectful. He's always been that, you know, like he -- But he wears his emotions on his sleeves too, you know, and he, he might be one of the most competitive persons I've ever been around. I've been in a gym where they are playing pick-up in the middle of September, season hasn't started, nothing is going on, and he's ruthless. You know, like this is how his mind works. And I think those competitive people in the world, you know, have an edge about them. The most incredible thing is how his game has evolved with time. He's very thoughtful. He's a visionary of the game, you know. Like, he knew where the 3-point game was going and how he established it. As a human being, family guy, you know, like Kyle Lowry is, is, is Kyle Lowry. You know, like and the best.

JP: I wonder how you think his story and his trajectory might fit into sort of the larger story of the Raptors' evolution, maybe especially as the team works to rebuild now.

MASAI UJIRI: You know, um, I want to hope that there's going to be bigger and better than Kyle Lowry because he has opened up that door. Yeah, he's, yeah, all these records and what he's done, you know, these things, he broke other people's records. You know, like, there are other people that were spoken of as the best Raptors of all times, you know. Like you can argue Vince Carter and how he made young players wanted to-- He set up Cory Josephs and the Wiggins and all these guys. The Barretts.

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NEWS PRESENTER: RJ Barrett, the latest and some say the biggest name in basketball to come out of Canada. He's already got the hardware, including a recent Harry Jerome Award, an accolade usually reserved for people so much further into their careers.

MASAI UJIRI: They watched Vince Carter, right? At one point you could argue DeMar. You know, like what Demar did, incredible. Yeah, and it was unfortunate how everything went, you know, like, but I still see him that way. You know, like he's a Raptor that stands out in an incredible way. Yeah, and then you look at people that were here too that didn't stay that long. You know, like Kawhi Leonard might arguably, too, be, you know, like a one-year greatest Raptor of all time, you know?

JP: Fair, fair. Yeah. [laughs]

MASAI UJIRI: Yeah, you know what I mean? Like so, and then the talents of the Tracy McGradys or Chris Boshes, you know. Like so, but Kyle just came and, you know, and that took off. And what gives the most credit to that? This championship.

JP: Do you think, um... he was also talking about leadership. He was a leader on the team. And is there a deficit on the team now, and do you have to kind of rebuild that?

MASAI UJIRI: No, we're going to rebuild as a team. We're a young team, but there's no deficit in leadership. You know, Fred is an unbelievable leader. Yeah, this is where everybody is going to see now, you know, like the kind of leader he is. And we're not a team of now. There's going to be growing pains, trust me. You know, like it's not-- sometimes it's gonna be tough to watch, you know. Like but, we know what's coming. We know, you know, we're, um, we're excited about the young talent. They are excited to play, I think, to see how OG, Pascal, Fred are going to evolve as leaders, as lead players. And then the young guys, you know, like the Barnes, the Malachis, the Dalanos. In sports, people think now, right? You know, and this is where we have to be patient, you know, like and let it grow.

JP: Right, right. Maybe it's not just sports that people are so obsessed with the now. Um, but you were saying, this is a long, a long game. Um, you're not only known for the work that you do with the Raptors, but you also have a reputation for helping African players find their path within the NBA. Players like Pascal, like Serge, arguably the biggest star from the last NBA season, Giannis.

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NBA PLAY-BY-PLAY ANNOUNCER: Well, Monty Williams has Mikal Bridges running the floor. Shot blocked by Antetokounmpo!

[Crowd cheering]

NBA PLAY-BY-PLAY ANNOUNCER: Once again comes out of nowhere and throws it off the backboard. Giannis down the other end and he banks it home!

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NBA PLAY-BY-PLAY ANNOUNCER: Giannis on the break, to the rim!

[Crowd erupts]

NBA PLAY-BY-PLAY ANNOUNCER: Plus the foul!

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NBA COMMISSIONER ADAM SILVER: No doubt, given he was the two-time MVP in the league, this year's Bill Russell Finals MVP: Giannis Antetokounmpo!

[Teammates and crowd cheer]

JP: Giannis is originally from Nigeria, as are you, and can you talk to me a little bit about your connection with him?

MASAI UJIRI: You know, um, I don't talk too publicly about that one. Giannis and his family are so dear to me. Um, we just have a unique relationship and friendship that honestly now goes beyond basketball. You know, so I leave it at that.

JP: Why don't you talk about what it meant to you when you saw him crowned last season's MVP.

MASAI UJIRI: Yeah, incredible. I remember watching, watching it and feeling incredibly like proud, you know, like of what the young man accomplished, you know. Like and that fight, you know, like to see that spirit, you know, like you've seen it from a young age. It was incredible.

[music]

JP: We're seeing more African players than ever before in the NBA. And I wonder where you expect things to be 10, 20 years from now.

MASAI UJIRI: The camps are growing. The players, social media, things are even more exposed. How do we build infrastructure, how do we continue to grow the game, coaching. All those things become more difficult as the game gets wider and wider. But I'm encouraged by the BAL league. It's incredible that the NBA was able to do this.

JP: I'll just note for our listeners, this is the Basketball Africa League. [MASAI: Yes.] It's sort of a premier men's league that is fairly new.

MASAI UJIRI: Yes. Started, first championship was in April [JP: Mm-hmm.] this year.

JP: Talking about building infrastructure and the camps. You do so much of that work through Giants of Africa, and I think you now operate in 17 countries on the continent. And I wonder how does that work connect with your upbringing in Nigeria and falling in love with basketball?

MASAI UJIRI: Well, when we do camps, the kids sit on the floor, and we speak to them. And I sat on the floor just like that at a basketball camp for my beloved coach in Nigeria, Oliver Johnson, who was an American that moved to Nigeria with the Peace Corps and started coaching basketball. And when I look at those kids I see myself. And when I see myself, I see those kids. You know, in every single way. Yeah, if I can make it and I can get to this place -- when I say make it, I mean make it up to the NBA -- these kids can make it even further, you know. Like, they are more talented, they're smarter. But these youth, they need a path. And the education of sports for me becomes really incredibly important for them to grow.

JP: You know, I know you certainly touched on this already, but I wonder if you could just elaborate for me a little bit more. Like, you go back every year in your time off, and I guess you don't have to go back every year, and in your time off you could just--

MASAI UJIRI: Shh, don't tell my wife.

[laughter]

JP: [laughing] You could just, you could just take the time off, right?

MASAI UJIRI: You're killing, you're killing me right now.

[laughter]

JP: Um, so why?

MASAI UJIRI: This is what we were born to do, you know. This is, it's an obligation for me. If I'm put in this chair to be the president of the Toronto Raptors and I don't win and I don't win for others, I don't know where success is. Yeah, the success comes from really building and growing those youth on the continent of Africa and everywhere around the world, and I feel that it's an obligation.

JP: I was watching this HBO documentary about you recently, and there's this moment. You bring the trophy, the Larry O'Brien trophy, back to Nigeria, and you're sitting with your parents. And you say:

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MASAI UJIRI: [tearful] Thank you for raising me the right way. I came from something... I came from something big.

JP: I wonder, can you take me back to that moment? What did you mean when you said that?

MASAI UJIRI: Well, look at where my parents set me up to be. They raised me the right way. My dad would always say to me, be honest to people. Yeah, respect people. Respect women. You know, and um, those things always resonated, you know, with me in an incredible way. You know, and it's funny, you come down to the basic fundamentals of life, of looking somebody in the eye and telling them hello or showing some kind of kindness. Everybody can be as smart as they want to be, or anybody can go on the internet as much as they want. You know, like but who are you as a person? Who are you as a human being? And I said I come from something big because they made me, um, at least think about life that way.

JP: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. I wonder if we could spend a little bit of time also talking about the past year in the NBA. So other than being an advocate for African basketball, you've also been outspoken on issues of racial justice. And we really saw that come to a head in the NBA bubble after the death of George Floyd.

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COACH DOC RIVERS: All you do is keep hearing about fear. It's amazing why we keep loving this country, and this country does not love us back.

STERLING BROWN: The last few days in our home state of Wisconsin, we've seen the horrendous video of Jacob Blake being shot in the back seven times by a police officer in Kenosha and the additional shooting of protesters. Despite the overwhelming plea for change, there has been no action, so our focus today cannot be on basketball.

LEBRON JAMES: We are scared as black people in America. Black men, black women, black kids. We are terrified.

JP: Players wore messages on their jersey. They withheld their work. They shut down games. And it was this incredible demonstration of showing the world their influence and power that it sort of... well, it transcended sport, right? And I wonder what, what you took away from that time.

MASAI UJIRI: Whatever we took away is still happening now. You know, like, and the the -- I think what George Floyd did was I think set up the whole world for another, another movement, you know, like that just continues. The one thing I loved about the past year and a half was, yeah, in some ways Black people became bolder. When George Floyd's neck-- cop had his knee on his neck, okay, he's crying for his mom, he's bleeding. He's peeing on himself and can't go nowhere. He's handcuffed. Yeah, who are you as a human being? You don't need to be a cop. Who were those people standing there that were actually seeing this happen? And I look at that and I think there's ways and ways to go, where we all have to like respect each other and know that this doesn't matter anymore. I said the colour of our skin is old, is old-fashioned. It doesn't matter where you're born. You could be born somewhere completely like different. Yeah, I look at my daughter. She could have been born in Samburu. Yeah, and she could have been born Libya. She could have been born in many different places. Does that make her a different, beautiful, unbelievable girl? It doesn't.

JP: Do you see the Raptors, and the NBA I guess by extension, playing an important role moving forward here? Like making sure that these issues stay in the spotlight, that people are talking about them?

MASAI UJIRI: Yes, I do. I do. I think the players are doing an incredible job, individually and collectively, where they can. We have to think about them too as youth. You know, like they need guidance. You know, they need exposure too. We need to give them even a bigger platform, you know, like to speak about these things, to act on these things. To give them resources. You know, like because they are the ones that kids look up to.

JP: I wonder if we could talk about something that I don't want to spend too much time rehashing because I know it is very much in the past, but, you know, our listeners will of course know about the altercation that you had after the NBA championship win with the officer in Oakland.

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ALAMEDA COUNTY SHERIFF'S DEPUTY: Back the f--k up, man. [Bleeped audio]

MASAI UJIRI: What are you pushing me for? I'm the president of the Raptors.

[Bleeped audio]

JP: I just wonder, now that you have gone through the legal system, if there's anything that you have taken away from that experience that you might like to, to share with us.

MASAI UJIRI: Yes, plenty. It showed me, that experience and that incidence just showed me that I am a public figure and I, I had an opportunity to tackle this issue because of my position. And it makes me think that people that are not in my position or people that don't have the opportunity that I have, it made me really think, how do they come out of this, how do they survive? It happens everywhere. And no cameras. There's no bail money. There's no lawyers. I had all of those. So in some ways I was blessed that it came out that way where I can actually now figure out ways. And I'm working hard on it, you know, to help other people.

[music]

JP: We know that of course you want the Raptors to win another championship, we all want that of course. But I guess one question that I hear a lot of people talk about when they talk about you is what might come next I guess. You know, we talked about some people that you're very close with, Barack Obama. You know, you were just on the campaign trail with Justin Trudeau. Do you see yourself maybe pursuing a future in politics? People talk about that a lot when they talk about you.

MASAI UJIRI: They do?

JP: They do. I hear it all the time.

MASAI UJIRI: [chuckles] Uh. Yeah, I, I am interested, you know, in what goes on in the world. The way I look at it is I have a good voice where I am today, and I'm appreciative of that and I don't take it for granted. So we'll see what the future brings.

JP: So, so maybe. [laughs] Maybe.

MASAI UJIRI: So I'm telling you I'm already a politician from that answer, [Jayme laughs] huh?

[laughter]

JP: Yeah, you just won't, you just won't answer the ques-- You're perfect. You're perfect. Um, final question. I'm hoping that we can end this conversation -- which has been wonderful, thank you so much -- with the high point of your professional career, uh, the NBA championship night in Oakland. And I wonder if there's a quiet moment that you might be willing to share with us about that night that will sort of stay with you forever.

MASAI UJIRI: There are a couple moments of it and because of what happened in Oakland, the moment on the court was taken away from me. But I will never ever forget my wife ordering... I can't remember if it was In-N-Out or Chick-fil-A. And we had to fly back to Toronto because my daughter was graduating from... when you're 5, what are you graduating from, huh?

JP: Maybe kindergarten? When she's 5? [MASAI: Yes.] Yeah, yeah.

MASAI UJIRI: Yes. Kindergarten. So, but when we got on the plane, and we had the burgers and the pilots had champagne for us, you know, it was the the moment, just two of us, you know, like there, and all the texts that you got, you got from friends, people, well-wishers, everybody. Prayers from Africa. And then you take off. And I don't know-- I can't remember if we had Wi-Fi on the plane or we slept off. And then you wake up in the morning in Toronto, and there's another millions of texts that came in. That moment, those moments were incredible. You know, like to just sit back and you are not even being bothered by anybody but this. To see my kids, you know, like when you walk in to the door. And we came in from San Francisco, we've come from the airport. It was the most incredible like feeling because they had watched it, they had followed it, you know, like and you can actually feel it even though they were that-- they were young.

JP: Yeah. Yeah. That's really wonderful. Um, Masai Ujiri, thank you so much for this. Thank you.

MASAI UJIRI: Thank you for having me. Thank you.

[Music: Theme]

EC: That was Jayme's conversation with longtime Raptors president Masai Ujiri from 2021. The team cut ties with Ujiri late last week. That's all for today. I'm Elaine Chau. Thanks for listening to Front Burner.

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Encore: ex-Raptors President Masai Ujiri - Transcript

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